Raffi Torres: The $1 Million Dollar Domino?
By adding Mr. Torres to the nebulous forward ranks the Canucks are officially $3,658,333 over the cap. Today would be an ideal time to play with capgeek to figure out how the hell Mitchell is supposed to fit into the budget.
On the face of it, there's certainly a lot to like about the signing. He's cheap (injuries sliced his previous contract of $2.75 down to barely the seven figure mark) and brings some sandpaper, PP experience and scoring prowess along with it.
He also re-introduces some familiar question marks and could be the domino that sets the stage - barring any camp standouts of course - for opening night.
Again, the good about Torres: he had strong years before and directly after the lockout with the Oilers; their SC run of 2005-06 he notched 27 goals in the regular season and added 11 points in the post. He suffered an ACL injury before leaving Edmonton but strung together some solid seasons in Columbus while also contributing to their top six on occasion. Before he was traded last season to Buffalo, he had 12 goals and 31 points playing on a line with Jakub Voracek and Derek Brassard.
Our initial guess last night was wrong in that we thought Torres was a PK'er; rather he's done some decent work on the man advantage, with 22 PP tallies over his career. He also added six game winners two seasons ago too (for comparison, Daniel lead the team with eight last season). One more tidbit of the useless variety: he has scored more against Vancouver than any other team.
Courtesy of Mike McLean from The Cannon, here's the Blue Jackets take on our new toy:
Raffi is an interesting player. During his time with the Jackets he was known for two things- being a maniac on the ice and scoring clutch goals. You can expect him to chip in with 10-15 goals given the opportunity, and every game you will see a guy who gives his all. He hits everything that moves, and plays a bit of an agitating role. Unfortunately his style leads to bad penalties on occasion, along with odd man rushes against due to him not being in position.
On the whole though Raffi is a great player to have on your team. In a checking or energy role he could excel, but putting him in a strict system may hurt his game. He can also moonlight on a scoring line and not look out of place. Raffi's true value shows in the playoffs, given his clutch offense and physical style.
Over the past (*checks fake wrist watch*) 12 hours I've warmed to Torres more. I get my back up a little when I see the phrase low risk / high reward since that is precisely what Bernier and Wellwood started off as. Frustratingly inconsistent is another Bernier-like quality that makes me want to slam a brick into my face. One of the last things an AV-lead squad needs is another guy who takes boneheaded calls. Also we shouldn't ignore his failure in Buffalo (read towards the bottom here) though, to be fair, he was buried on their fourth line and was at least honest about the quality of his play. His failure in Buffalo may point to their system and how he was used.
I'm probably splitting hairs for a guy who is still young-ish and comes at that discount. What role he serves is the next question since Vancouver has a couple holes to fill. AV would be insane not to try Torres - a crash and bang guy with good hands around the net - out along with the Sedins as an all ginger, daywalking red attack line (the line name possibilities are endless). Or he gives AV the comfort to move Samuelsson to the first line and drop Torres to the second with Kesler and Raymond though I'm not sure if that's the best fit for him. In either example, Torres gets a competent center & consistently tougher minutes than in his previous campaigns.
If Torres is bound for the bottom of the chart (let's say Cody Hodgson or Sergei Shirokov steps into the top six), he joins a mix that already includes Manny Malhotra, Jannik Hansen, Tanner Glass, Rick Rypien, Darcy Hordichuk, Victor Oreskovich, Joel Perrault, Jeff Tambellini, Alexandre Bolduc and Guillaume Desbiens (this is ignoring any camp try outs and standouts or Bieksa-like trade dumps). We were struggling to guess at these lines already, but with Torres in there I don't see how Desbiens, Boldic, Perrault, Tambellini or Oreskovich get true playing time. They'll definitely need to earn it; just like last fall, the logjam at the bottom will be one of the most anticipated parts of camp and one that could make a simply massive difference when Vancouver lines up against the Chicago's and San Jose's of the world in the regular season.
No matter where Torres lands, these are all good problems to have heading into September (well, not that cap problem). If nothing else he joins the likes of Burrows, Kesler, Rypien, Hammer, Ballard and Glass - as well as postseason hitting champion Sammy and maybe Bieksa, SOB and Alberts - as folks who make playing the Canucks tougher, if not flatly more annoying.
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Versatile, Motivated, Forechecker?
Yeah, I’ll take that. He’ll be motivated to do better than a 1m/1yr deal next year, and he hits anything that moves. I think he can probably play on any line in a pinch, and he seems really annoying, which is nice to have on the team.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
"You had to have the BIG salad."
"Suit up."
"Eric, when your mom says are you ready for your catheter...the answer is no."
I guess
we’ll find out soon if this was a good call by GMMG.
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain, 2010 Art Ross Trophy Winner and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Aug 25, 2010 11:11 AM PDT reply actions
Me too
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain, 2010 Art Ross Trophy Winner and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Aug 25, 2010 11:17 AM PDT up reply actions
Why? His opinion doesn’t carry anymore water than anyone else’s.
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
No, but it’s often vastly different, and I appreciate that.
by Beantown Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions
it’s often vastly different, and I appreciate that
This is why I want to hear what he thinks.
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain, 2010 Art Ross Trophy Winner and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Aug 25, 2010 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Boom Mitchell under the cap for opening day
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Mikael Samuelsson ($2.500m)
Mason Raymond ($2.550m) / Cody Hodgson ($1.666m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m)
Raffi Torres ($1.000m) / Manny Malhotra ($2.500m) / Jannik Hansen ($0.825m)
Victor Oreskovich ($0.575m) / Rick Rypien ($0.550m) / Tanner Glass ($0.625m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) / Keith Ballard ($4.200m)
Alexander Edler ($3.250m) / Christian Ehrhoff ($3.100m)
Willie Mitchell ($1.500m) / Kevin Bieksa ($3.750m)
Shane O’Brien ($1.600m)
GOALTENDERS
Roberto Luongo ($5.333m) /Cory Schneider ($0.900m)
CARRY-OVER BONUS PENALTY: $90,000
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $58,215,000; BONUSES: $1,850,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $3,035,000
Damn
So close too….
http://www.nucksmisconduct.com/2010/8/25/1650286/report-mitchell-to-los-angeles
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Say it ain’t so Willy!
"Last season we couldn't win at home and we were losing on the road. My failure was that I couldn't think of any place else to play." - Harry Neale
by Diehardnuck on Aug 25, 2010 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions
Lookin' good
too bad Mitch is gone.
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain, 2010 Art Ross Trophy Winner and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Aug 25, 2010 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Another great article Yankee, like you, over the past 12 hours I’ve warmed to Torres more and more, and your article points out other qualities that I wasn’t quite aware of.
If he’s a third liner, then Malhotra/Torres feels better than Wellwood/Bernier.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
I would think Wellwood would feel better
he has smooth edges.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions
This is true. Wellwood is not rigid, gotta give him that.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions
Sounds like a forward version of Bieksa...
He’s gritty, he chips in a few here or there, and takes boneheaded penalties.
This signing reeked of Mitchell committing elsewhere. No way was MG committing any money he could use on Mitchell. Then again, at a $3.5mil/yr. price tag for two years, I don’t think Gillis could have ponied up that kind of money.
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
also probably a consolation prize after asham stayed east.
btw, pretty sure the canucks wouldn’t have had to go to 3.5 to get willie to stay. from his interviews i got the impression that he’d have done the hometown discount to stick around.
Me too. The second year was probably the clincher. There was a Twitterati rumour to the affect that they were the only team to go two years of the four.
Term was definetely the sticking point for Willie.
But honestly, how much of a discount was Mitch willing to give MG if the offer was for 2 years? Everyone here was rosterbating Mitchell at $1.5mil which was a little greedy, considering the fact that he signed for $3.5mil per. What would have kept Willie here? $2.5 per? $3?
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
Well, a one year deal would have performance bonuses. I believe the 1.5 would have been his base in rosterbation fantasies, and another 1 to 1.5 in bonuses for lasting the season and whatnot.
Going 500K over that, and adding a second year is what he Kings had to do to get their man. It is a bit of a risk if his bell gets rung.
But the same reason we wanted him here for is why its high reward for them too.
Good move as long as he stays healthy.
Only money on the insurance ( or LTIR ) if he gets hurt again.
The Kings did overpay, but only by 500K.. And maybe that 2nd year.
I’d like to officially welcome myself to SB Nation by making my first comment one of unbridled optimism: The events of this year’s offseason – both on the homefront and abroad – make our beloved Canucks the favorite to come out of the West in the spring. As I saw it, we had two major concerns as the offseason began, and both have been addressed. We’ve now got the blueline depth to survive the inevitable injuries, and we’ve got the kind of bottom six that can seriously test the depth of our opponents’ bluelines. I would contend that the Torres signing gives us the last bit of hitting we needed, plus a depth scorer who can play on any of our four lines when guys get hurt. The agony of June’s defeat is genuinely giving way to excitement.
That was way too long, but I had a lot to get off my chest.
Hey now…that’s how you enter a room. Welcome to the site, thanks for joining up!
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Unbridled optimism? I just puked in my mouth.
Welcome anyway.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Hahaha. Don’t mind the old man in the corner. Welcome, Canuckle!
by Beantown Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions
I am not old!!!
I am prematurely curmudgeonly. Get it right.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Size and grit on the blueline is a glaring hole in this lineup, and it becomes worse if Juice gets shipped, with Willie gone.
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
Maybe
That’s one reason why I’d be okay with Alberts sticking around – I think he can be effective if he stays within striking distance of the net – and most have noted the improved play from O’Brien. That and Ballard’s got loads of grit, but is still a little careless in its use.
I agree about Alberts. Force him to be more stay at home and he’s not that bad. You’re talking about a guy who lead two different teams two years straight in hits.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Aug 25, 2010 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions
How did we go from being a deep defense to having a glaring hole because a once loved UFA did not sign here Nuuuugs. Just curious. As to size, well, Alberts is 6’5", Edler is 6’3", So is OBrien. Ehrhoff is 6’2". Hammer is 6’1", and Ballard is 5’!!, so I guess I can see the misconception.
But both of those racked up a lot of hits ( and stayed healthy doing it ) on their other teams. Ballard blocks a ton of shots as well.
All the young kids ( well, excpet Billt Sweatts bro, he is only 5’9" ) are all in the 6 foot plus category.
People forget that a couple drafts and signings could be bonafide callups and possible surprises. Guys like Connauton, Andersson, Oberg, Tanev, Sauve and maybe Zimmerman are probably going to be battling for ice time in Manitoba, but the gap between the farm last year and this one is big. A lot more guys coming out of college and junior and at the AHL level.
It would be sweet if one or two of the kids could step it up this year.
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
They are getting closer.
And don’t get me wrong. I was heavy on the sign Willie bandwagon. But its obvious that the Kings overpaid a little , using their Cap room to get the man they wanted. I feel good for Willie and his family, and thank him for the memories.
But to say that we have a glaring hole is a little much I think. Do we like the idea of a Top 10 shutdown guy? Absolutely. But not at that price with the guys we have.
I am totally OK with starting the season with our Top 4 of Edler, Ehrhoff, Ballard and Hamhuis, with Bieksa, Obrien, Alberts if he isn’t a cap cut. Rome ( he makes league min and is totally worth that money. ) is a useful player too.. Hell, we still have Baumer too!
But yeah, one of the young bucks stepping up and say…replacing Alberts deal with his ELC works too.
As does having guys good enough in Manitoba to be able to call up.
I pick Tanev and Connauton, maybe Oberg or Sauve for call up time this year. You?
Sauve hands down
he is going to make a run at this team out of camp and should be the first call up.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 3:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Another?
Or a first?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions
You know we’ll always be there to pump up your tires, Sec. ;)
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
I love you guys
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 3:54 PM PDT up reply actions
He has the talent
and Luc Bourdon almost did it. In fact I think he should have made the team that first year but that’s long enough ago that I have let it go.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions
I didn’t. I just didn’t think he was ready at the time – he looked a bit lost to me – but I’d be quite happy if Sauve played well enough to be our call-up.
One development I really love is that we don’t feel the pressure to push draft picks into the league any more.
When Bourdon
was 18 he was phenomenal in training camp and preseason. I have never seen an 18 year old D man play that well.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 26, 2010 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions
I don't think it's really that debatable
to be honest. His first camp here he was incredible. Pretty much everyone agreed he played well enough to make the team. But they didn’t think he was ready for a full season.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 26, 2010 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Agreed.
I’m not expecting any of the D to come up this year. Andersson maybe, if he does shockingly well in camp; Oberg is going to have to add something to his 165 pounds – offence or size or both – before he’s going to be at the NHL level. But yeah, I’m really looking forward to seeing what happens along the blue line in two or three years.
Alberts is 6’5" – 218lbs – and a fucking pylon. The game’s too fast for a defenseman like this, and he’s the only big body besides SOB (6’3" – 230lbs.) who’s really got to step up his game to earn AV’s trust in shutdown matchups. Edler is 6’3" – 215lbs. and doesn’t use his body, if he could start using his size I’d have a lot more faith. Erhoff, Hamhuis, and Ballard are all puck movers, and all just a stone’s throw over 6’/200lbs. Are you really going to throw those three out against the Byfuglien’s and Handzus’s of the world, who are sitting on Lu’s face and expect them to clear them out?
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
Okay glaring hole was a little much for a defense like this, but my point still remains. Lu needs someone policing the crease to keep his head in the right place.
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
Love the optimism!
But take it from a crusty old realist, when you start feeling really good, don’t forget to look both ways before you cross the street!
If playing with the Sedins helps Torres play more consistently
that could work really well. The Concorde line — Vancouver’s own SST.
by The Ancient Mariner on Aug 25, 2010 2:26 PM PDT reply actions
Maybe he really disliked living and working in Buffalo...
I was just thinking that perhaps Torres, just really hated living there. I couldn’t imagine getting a transfer from the Okanagan to… Buffalo. No offense, but, maybe living in Beautiful BC, may give him a fresh start?
So Far...
…I’ll guess he’s the first pick to step into the second line when Sammy ends up on the first to open the season. That little bit may be enough to to get to last years numbers, but he probably isn’t going to be getting the power play time he got last year.
If he can take a beating in front of the net, then maybe he’s on the second unit, but not much more than that.
I'm not certain he's actually an upgrade on Bernier...
…of course, I could be wrong, but his stats-line is awfully Bernier-like.
I think I’m just excessively biased against Torres, but all I’m seeing is a half-price Bernier.
Canucks fans talking about the Canucks: Pass it To Bulis!
Isn't that good enough
the knock on Bernier was he could be a great 4th or sometimes 3rd liner but he was over paid for that role. A cheaper Bernier is exactly what I was hoping we could get.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions
That's good enough
I guess. It just means I’m tempering my expectations. I’m fine with a cheaper Bernier, but I was consistently frustrated with Bernier without considering the contract terms.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the signing, I just don’t like Torres.
Canucks fans talking about the Canucks: Pass it To Bulis!
Oh yeah
I wouldn’t expect much more than Bernier. But at that price I think it’s good value.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on Aug 25, 2010 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Is that residual hate for a guy that was always a bit of a Canuck Killer?
I like that kind of player that other teams hate to play against.
This guy is another one of those when he is healthy.
Can’t beat the price either. And a one year deal means that he can be either a short term inconvenience or a big time steal depending on how well he plays.
I like having a bunch of those guys. Manny Malholtra was signed for a bunch of reasons, but hitting is definitely one of them.
Burr ( when healthy )Kesler, Glass, Rypien. New guy Oreskovich. Tambellini made a point of talking about playing tough and hitting more when he signed. I don’t know much of Perrault, but I know I remember that Volpatti broke records at his school for “pugnaciousness”. Stephan Schneider is friggen huge. If he plays that way…a big centre is always effective when they can hit too.
Returnees like Bolduc ( stay away from Mr Scott Alex!!) and Desbiens both play that abrasive style. Bliznak can hit and play hard on the forecheck. Sammy is an underrated hitter. Raymond and Hansen both seem to try and throw it around more.
And those are just the forwards. We added to guys that like to hit on the back end too!
There seems to be enough in the lineup up front. Adding Torres to that only makes the Canucks a team nobody wants to play against even more.
Hate to sound like a “fanboy”, but this team is deeper than most I remember. Hard not to get excited.
Yes, it's mainly residual hate.
I would hate it if we signed Milan Hejduk too.
Good call on Stefan Schneider. I think he’s a darkhorse to make the team as the 4th-line center.
Canucks fans talking about the Canucks: Pass it To Bulis!
Stephan Schneider is the biggest guy on the team at forward. Only Alberts tops him on the entire roster.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Aug 26, 2010 9:08 AM PDT up reply actions
Another Twitter Nugget.
He sounds sincerely jacked to be there.
I can’t remember if Pratt asked him “How good is THAT?” though…
fucking brilliant. what flag is that over the guy’s shoulder?
by Passive Voice on Aug 25, 2010 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions
hmmm
wiki seems to think it was in use 1921-1957. the more you know!
by Passive Voice on Aug 25, 2010 8:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Um...
Anyone seen his Wikipedia page? Apparently:
The following day after his marriage, he and Gianna had sex and are trying to start a family.
That was in his “Personal Life” section, to which I can say
Could you be a little less personal? Thanks.
Lulz
He was on the Daily Show? Give the man the captaincy!
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain, 2010 Art Ross Trophy Winner and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Aug 25, 2010 9:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Last year: Bernier @ 2M, Wellwood @ 1.2M
This year: Malhotra @ 2.5M, Torres @ 1M
My first thoughts were Oh &*i^ WTF on the Torres signing but I think the above math makes a lot of sense. Out with the old and in with the new. GMMG has given AV guys who can shuffle between lines and positions and have done so before. I like the effort.
Didn’t we take Bernier off Buffalo’s hands too? We did? Oh fucking great. heh
Nucks Misconduct
"Here goes nothin'" - Han Solo

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