Canucks Give O'Brien, Raymond, Hansen And Glass Qualifying Offers
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 11:42 AM PDT
in Free Agency
97 comments
So says Dan Murphy on Twitter. That is the same amount SOB was making last season. I'm pretty sure O'Brien is not going to go for that. That case will most likely go to arbitration. After that I think SOB is trade bait.
Edit: Matt Sekeres has just reported on Twitter that the Canucks have qualified the other 3 RFA's mentioned above as well.
**Update: The Canucks also gave qualifying offers to Mario Bliznak, Alex Bolduc, Eric Walsky and Sean Zimmerman.
More from Sekeres (and thanks missy): the dollar values for the qualifying offers for each player were:
Raymond: $708,000
O'Brien $1.6 million
Hansen: $605,000
Glass: $550,000
I am pretty sure that arguably all 4 players will seek more than that as all are eligible for arbitration.
OT: Keith Ballard was on the Team 1040 today. Here's the link to the audio.
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Today is the deadline, right?
I am hopeful for some similar news on Raymond and Hansen very soon. Or better, that they’ve both been resigned.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
I’m hoping that is the case for Raymond especially but I have a feeling all 3 go to arbitration.
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions
Oh there’s no doubt they’ll both be qualified. But yeah, I’m guessing arbitration- are you sure all three have arbitration rights?
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions
From about hockey.com:
Most players must have four years of NHL experience before they are eligible for salary arbitration (the term is reduced for those who signed their first NHL contract after the age of 20).
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions
If that’s true, then Raymond doesn’t qualify, nor does Hansen
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions
The CBA says
12.1. Eligibility.
(a) A player is eligible to elect salary arbitration if the
player meets the qualifications set forth in the following chart
and in Section 12.1(b) below:
First Contract Signing Age Minimum Level of
Professional Experience
Required to be
Eligible for Salary
Arbitration
18-20: 5 years professional experience
21: 4 years professional experience
22-23: 3 years professional experience
24: 2 years professional experience
25 and older: 1 year professional experience
A player aged 18 or 19 earns a year of ***"professional
experience" by playing ten or more NHL games (regular season
and/or playoffs) in a given season. A player aged 20 or above
(or who turns 20 between September 16 and December 31 of the year
in which he signs his first Player Contract) earns a year of
professional experience by playing ten or more professional games
under NHL contract in a given season.
(b) Only players who qualify as Restricted Free Agents as
described in Section 10.2 and who have not signed an Offer Sheet
may elect salary arbitration.
© As used in this Article, “age,” including “First
Contract Signing Age,” means a player’s age on September 15 of
the calendar year in which he first signs a Player Contract
regardless of his actual age on the date he signs such contract.
professional experience means NHL, AHL, in Europe, etc I take it.
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions
mattsekeres
Canucks make qualifying offers to all 4 RFAs: Mason Raymond, Shane O’Brien, Jannik Hansen and Tanner Glass.
Nucks Misconduct contributor (and occasional peacekeeper), can be found on Twitter.
So, what exactly is Mike Gillis up to?
Excellent
I really want Hansen and Glass back for 3L and 4L, respectively. Unless of course we can somehow squeeze a better option for 3L, in which case that looks like the makings of a solid 3L. But I think I’m comfortable with Hansen on L3.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
Yes on Hansen…I think we can get someone better than Glass and his “stone hands”.
Maybe Victor O’ is already penciled in that spot?
Glass
For 4L, I’m content with an energy guy who doesn’t have good hands. And he’s going to be dirt cheap, and he’s defensively responsible (IE – doesn’t think he’s a scorer and therefore makes stupid decisions).
I have a feeling that right now, the bottom 7 (with one not dressing) will include, in some conglomeration:
Hodgson, Hansen, Oreskovich, Glass, Rypien, Hordichuk and a TBD FA. Preferably a defensively responsible C. If we can get rid of Hordichuk (yes, please), then 2 spots are open: again, a defensively responsible C and a cheap winger.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
Glass lead this team in hits and earned his spot during training camp. I am fine with him coming back in a similar role. He earned it.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Absolutely
I don’t know what more you could ask for in a close-to-NHL-minimum 4LW.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
Bolduc = HELL YES. I’m a fan of the man
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 1:01 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m definitely down with bringing back Glass and Bolduc, with Rypien that makes a nice, or should I say nasty (maybe a little small?), fourth line.
Yes
I’d be 100% in support of that. Very cheap too. Small but nasty.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
he ended bolduc’s season in one of the most lopsided tilts you’ll ever see
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1cvOiKuxH8
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 29, 2010 5:45 AM PDT up reply actions
I agree. There are upgrades over Glass out there that can come in cheap. Im hoping we can get Matt Cullen as a 4th line center. Proven playoff performer, faceoff man with leadership. He may be too pricey for a 4th line center though.
Cullen
He’s going to be $2m+ (maybe even $3m). That’s too much for 4LC, in my books. If you want to have him to play on the wing on 3L, I’d be okay with that, I suppose, although that’s not really utilizing him effectively.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
I think if you brought in Cullen, you’d want him as your third line, penalty killing center. I think he’s too skilled to be on the fourth line.
As it stands it looks like our third line is Oreskovich, Wellwood and Hansen. I like Hansen, but I’d say the rest looks like it needs a little work.
I think Welly is set on testing the FA waters.
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
yeah, I think he’d probably get more money elsewhere. Calgary needs someone to pass the puck to Iginla! I’d hate to seem him in yellow and red though. Maybe he can go to Columbus.
Two smallish ex Leaf centres slotted into the Flames lineup for Iggy?
HAH! I would get over seeing Welly in their uni for that.
Though, because Sutter is so silly, that is probably all they can afford.
Unless they can sign Joke-inen to a FA deal for less…maybe lean on him to sign for less to make up for stealing their money before.
not sure. maybe there’s something wrong with the Calgary weed…..
Nucks Misconduct contributor (and occasional peacekeeper), can be found on Twitter.
So, what exactly is Mike Gillis up to?
Agreed
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
"One time I was invited to come to a social gathering. I was paid a handsome amount of money, and I brought a shotgun and a bottle of Tanqueray and showed those people the best f***ing time they’ve ever seen." - Kenny Powers
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Jun 28, 2010 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions
I like Cullen
As a 3rd line winger who can also play centre. Ideal for taking important face offs when lined up with a certain rookie centre (or said rookie gets waved out)…
I think $1.6M is more than fair for a #5 D-man who doesn’t offer any offense and is average defensively.
IIRC, SOB was looking for term more so than dollar value. Correct me if I’m wrong.
Poutine & Meatballs
Right now SOB would be our #6 d-man… is that worth $1.6 mill when our #7 d-man, Alberts, is earning $1.1 mill and our #8, Rome, is earning $0.7 mill, all might I add on 1-way contracts?
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, to be more accurate, they are our #6-8 d-men. How you rank them is up to you, but that’s clearly what I think.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Ha, ya I was going to say Rome over Alberts. I wasn’t a big fan of Rome last season but he’s a solid, cheap 7th D-man. Do we still have Lukowich signed? Wouldn’t mind him playing as the 6th defense.
I meant a #5 D-man in general. He’s not top 4 on any team in the league (that isn’t tanking it) but he likely wouldn’t be the worst either (#6-8). Thus, a #5 in my books.
Poutine & Meatballs
he played top 4 minutes once Mitchell was injured, IIRC.
Getting Ballard pushes him to #5, which, you are correct, is probably where he should be.
"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky
Having never followed the off-season before what’re the next steps for the players? Take the contract, go to arbitration (if they wanna stay with the Canucks but with more money) or go to free agency?
If they are unqualified, they can become FAs, otherwise by qualifying the team retains their rights.
They are free to negotiate with the team before arbitration.
Once the case is heard, then the arbitrator sets a number ( I think it can be one or two years )
If the team refuses the number…THEN the player becomes a FA.
Actually they are free to negotiate with any team, just that their original team has the option to match any signed offers and retain the player or relinquish the player in exchange for draft picks.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions
So in that instance team A (current team) and B are offering the same money and if the player signs with B they send some picks over. But this is only the case for RFA’s since nobody holds the rights to a UFA? I’m guessing this is so that the organisation that developed the player doesn’t waste their efforts/resources for little gain.
Are the RFAs free to negotiate with another team if they already have an offer from their current one?
I forgot the part about other team’s signing them.
I think once they are qualified, it has to go to arbitration, but not totally sure.
I think teams can chuck an offer at the RFA and then the team with the rights can match or say “adiose”. I guess you could call that aggressive negotiations. Also considered dirty pool to many GM’s
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions
via Team1040’s website, Sekeres reports that Raymond was offered $708,000 for one year in his qualifying offer. MayRay will obviously ask for more.
Glass got $550,000 and Hansen got $605,000. All 4 guys are eligible for arbitration.
Nucks Misconduct contributor (and occasional peacekeeper), can be found on Twitter.
So, what exactly is Mike Gillis up to?
WTF?
Really? 700k???
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
That’s what a qualifying offer is. Last year’s salary plus 10% (you could offer more, but don’t need to)
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions
You’d think offering the bare minimum would just piss players off.
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
damn, I added the names on top of SOB and kept the 1.6 million in the title. OOPS. Apologies
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 4:01 PM PDT up reply actions
i’m sure it’s understood that it’s not what the team thinks they’re worth, and not what they’re going to get.
by Passive Voice on Jun 28, 2010 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions
well there are noobs out there..plus that title went all over the sportsblogsosphere. FML
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 5:46 PM PDT up reply actions
You wouldn’t believe Chapman on TEAM with Pratt today.
Slagging on the Ballard deal like crazy.
He was mad because he seems to think Grabner is a huge star that just never had a chance.
His line was…“he was the most dangerous forward in the Chicago series…”
WTF Paul?
Just listened to the ballard thing...
…seems like a super-humble guy looking forward to be challenged and pressured. Kinda what the canucks need.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
Yeah…I like him, and think the deal was fair.
But Chappy seems to think Grabs is the best of the best.
I kind of thought he was redundant…like Gillis said…but Chapman IS the editor at Province Sports…
LOL
I just have a suspicion that Grabner is going to end up back in the AHL again.
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
I’ll bet he doesn’t. I’m pretty high on Grabner myself
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions
I’d make you a bet, but I think your plate is pretty full now. ;)
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
this one is pretty risky though. Calling the Flames and Leafs to make the playoffs isn’t though
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Of course it is
Seeing as both teams won’t be making the dance!
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
"One time I was invited to come to a social gathering. I was paid a handsome amount of money, and I brought a shotgun and a bottle of Tanqueray and showed those people the best f***ing time they’ve ever seen." - Kenny Powers
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Jun 28, 2010 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Not the first time I’ve disagreed with Chapman.
by Bobby Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 9:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Let me explain how the whole RFA thing works.
1. Teams must offer all pending RFAs a qualifying offer- which is their previous salary +10% (or more), or else those players become UFAs.
2. If a player signs the qualifying offer, well then that’s their contract.
3. Once ‘qualified’, a player is now an RFA if they don’t sign that offer (although I believe the offer remains open, and if the team withdraws it, the player becomes a UFA).
4. The qualifying offer is really just a placeholder while negotiations go on if the player is a good player (if the player is overpriced at their old contract, they usually won’t get qualified).
5. However, while an RFA, any team can now offer that player any contract they want.
6. If the RFA accepts a contract from another team, his original team then has the option to match.
7. If the original team does not match, then the player now belongs to the team that signed him, but in return the original team receives compensation in the form of draft picks the next year. The amount and quality of draft picks is determined by how large the salary cap hit for the player will be.
8. Complicating this further is that many RFAs have arbitration rights, meaning that if they don’t sign the qualifying offer, they can then request that a neutral arbitrator set their salary, for which a hearing will be held, and the team and the player will state their case for what they think the salary should be and why. The arbitration decision is final. If the team does not accept, then the player becomes a UFA. The player must accept if he wants to play in the NHL.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 3:43 PM PDT reply actions
Very clarifying
i Just have one question, who is that “neutral arbitrator” that set the salary ?
thanks
Beantown, can I copy this and make a post? Or, can you copy it into a fanpost and I’ll post it onto the main page? Many people will want to know this information.
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m still not sure how all 4 qualify for arbitration rights. Has Raymond had 4 years of professional experience?
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 4:14 PM PDT up reply actions
From above:
22-23: 3 years professional experience
24: 2 years professional experience
25 and older: 1 year professional experience
I believe Mason got his first year of professional experience when he was 22, therefore he only needs 3 years before arbitration becomes available, rather than 4.
So don't get violent and don't get caught with your head down, the night she stole the moon.
by thelastjohnny on Jun 28, 2010 4:19 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought it was kind of ambiguous…did the four years include jr’s? They’re professional too if they pay…and they do.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
I’m pretty sure the CHL is considered semi-pro.
As well, I am under the impression that “professional experience” in the CBA is defined as NHL experience, where a full season is considered a minimum of 10 games played. I haven’t had a chance to double check it, but that’s what I recall from last year.
So don't get violent and don't get caught with your head down, the night she stole the moon.
by thelastjohnny on Jun 28, 2010 4:31 PM PDT up reply actions
I’ve heard that playing in the AHL and Europe counts…
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, this is leaving me a bit flabbergasted.
So don't get violent and don't get caught with your head down, the night she stole the moon.
by thelastjohnny on Jun 28, 2010 4:48 PM PDT up reply actions
A player aged 18 or 19 earns a year of “professional
experience” by playing ten or more NHL games (regular season
and/or playoffs) in a given season. A player aged 20 or above
(or who turns 20 between September 16 and December 31 of the year
in which he signs his first Player Contract) earns a year of
professional experience by playing ten or more professional games
under NHL contract in a given season.
However, one might argue that since Mason Raymond first signed a player contract when he was 21, he has 4 years before he’s allowed arbitration, which would mean he doesn’t get it until next year. So really, I’m not sure.
So don't get violent and don't get caught with your head down, the night she stole the moon.
by thelastjohnny on Jun 28, 2010 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions
SHHH! I just about have a post about about that!
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 28, 2010 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions
1. @ Zan: I don’t know much about the arbitration rules. There may also be a clause in his contract that gives him the right to arbitration for his next contract beyond the mandatory CBA requirements.
2. @ Zan: Yeah feel free to put that in a post.
3. @ Deh: I don’t know who they are, but typically in regular employment arbitration, management and unions just pick people they both can live with. I assume the NHLPA and the NHL have many people they call on, presumably lawyers with experience in entertainment/sports law.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, and it’s the same arbitrators who do everyone of that year, I believe. It’s all done over a few days one after another, so who they consider equal players essentially get the same offer from them.
So don't get violent and don't get caught with your head down, the night she stole the moon.
by thelastjohnny on Jun 28, 2010 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions
OK, RFA’s and Arbitration post up here. I finally took the time to give a shit and actually look into it. Thanks, Beantown
RFAs
I’d like Raymond, Hansen and Glass (especially Raymond) signed as soon as possible to a new contract. I hope Gillis is working on that today and tomorrow. I don’t want him to be targeted with an offer sheet, because that could make for either a very difficult decision in letting him go or a cap crunch in matching.
Make it reasonable and get it done.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
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