Just what the hell is a Keith Ballard?
by Passive Voice on Jun 26, 2010 3:19 AM PDT
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-Keith Ballard is a 5'11", 205ish-pound, left-hand-shooting defenceman from Baudette, Minnesota, which is pretty much Canada.
-He's 27, was drafted 11th-overall by Buffalo in 2002, and has played for Phoenix and Florida in a 5-year career.
-His counting numbers show 149 points (33+116) and a minus-11 +/- difference in 397 career NHL games.
-He averages about one penalty minute per game played. Left to his own devices, he'll get into about 3.5 fights this year. He'll win, like, none of them, unless it's against Sidney Crosby (more on that later).
-Having played for Phoenix and Florida, he's never tasted postseason action at the NHL level--in fact, his only postseason experience at all seems to be 10 games with the USHL's Omaha Lancers in 2001.
-He signed a six-year, $25.2M deal last September, preventing him from becoming an RFA. He has 5 years @ 4.2 per left.
Okay. An inauspicious start. After the jump, a slightly more in-depth look at Keith Ballard.
I'm going to look at his performance over the last three seasons. This is mostly because behindthenet's data only goes back to 2007-2008 (that's "The Year the Canucks Missed the Playoffs for Reasons Still Not Totally Clear to Me and Luongo's Wife Had a Kid or Something and Nonis Got Fired" for those of you who keep track of time like me), and also because I don't really care what Ballard did as a 22-year-old.
For Reference
-2007-2008 saw Ballard on the Coyotes, whose D corps at the time consisted principally of Z.Michalek, E.Jovanovski, D.Morris, and N.Boyton (rankings out of five).
-2008-2009 saw Ballard on the Panthers, whose D corps at the time consisted principally of J.Bouwmeester, K.Skrastins, B.McCabe, J.Cullimore, and N.Boyton (six)
-2009-2010 saw Ballard on the Panthers, whose D corps at the time consisted principally of B.McCabe, D.Kulikov, D.Seidenberg, J.Leopold, and B.Allen (six).
***
Icetime
First, let's look at Ballard's icetime breakdown at Even-Strength, PK, PP, and total (rank among team Dmen in brackets):
2007-08: 17:02(3rd), 3:31(1st), 0:41(3rd), 21:15(4th)
2008-09: 17:37(3rd), 2:25(3rd), 2:20(3rd), 22:23(3rd)
2009-10: 17:43(4th), 2:42(2nd), 1:58(4th), 22:24(4th)
Summary: We got our hands on a guy who's pretty clearly been used as a utility-infielder-type 3/4 Dman. Which, in and of itself, is rarely a bad thing.
***
Real-Time Stats
On to his "real-time stats", as compiled by the NHL, which here include hits, shot-blocks, and takeaway-to-giveaway ratio (higher the better, obvs) (team D rank in brackets). Keep in mind that the recording of these stats is pretty sketchy league-wide, which makes interteam comparisons tough. Intrateam comparisons, though, are probably safe-ish:
2007-08: 169(1st), 162(1st), 0.89(3rd)
2008-09: 172(1st), 136(2nd), 0.35(3rd)
2009-10: 156(1st), 201(1st), 0.30(6th)
Summary: Ballard gets credited for throwing a lot of hits, which is probably a positive. Our only guys who compile that number of hits are Andrew Alberts and maybe Shane O'Brien. Florida doesn't appear to inflate their hit totals too terribly, so I'm fairly comfortable in saying that Ballard will help us be more physical. On the other hand, the turnover numbers got pretty ugly this year. Let's hope it's scorer error or an eight-month coma that Ballard snapped out of in, like, late May.
***
Powerplay
Included below are his points/goals/primary assists/secondary assists per 60 minutes of PP time and his PP Corsi per 60 (adjusted to be relative to his team). Info c/o BtN.
2007-08: 4.34/2.17/1.09/1.09 (2nd/2nd/2nd/3rd), -21(5th)
2008-09: 1.28/0/0.64/0.64 (5th/4th/3rd/4th), 1.1(basically tied for 2nd)
2009-10: 3.71/.74/1.48/1.48 (1st/1st/3rd/2nd), 7.2(1st)
Summary: This looks sorta promising. He was probably the most efficient PP guy on the Panthers this year, though given that team finished 29th in PP%, that might be damning with faint praise. He's no Gonchar, but he can probably help on our second-unit PP this year. Who knows--maybe a regular shift there (remember, he's never really been given a tonne of time time on the PP) will help him unleash some previously-unseen torrent of offensive power. Realistically, though, he'll play with Salo on a solid 2nd unit.
***
Penalty-Kill
Lord knows we could use some help. Shown are his Corsi (again, relative to his team) and his ranking among his teams' Dmen in terms of Quality of Competition. Hat-tip: BtN.
2007-08: -20(5th), 3rd(of six)
2008-09: 6.7(3rd), 3rd(of seven)
2009-10: -14.3(3rd), 1st(of three)
Summary: The numbers for this year are somewhat incomplete, because both Leopold and Seidenberg spent big chunks of the season with Florida, but have their data appear elsewhere. Regardless, Ballard looks, again, like a solid second-unit option.
***
Even-Strength
Finally, a look at the most important stuff. Listed are his points/60, his Corsi(relative to his team, again)/60, his rank in terms of quality of competition, and his zone-start (O-Zone faceoffs/[OZ+Dzone FOs]; lower means tougher assignments). Thanks, BtN!
2007-08: 0.68(4th) -8.4(7th), 1st(of 8), 40% (3rd toughest)
2008-09: 1.08(2nd), 7.3(1st), 4th(of 7), 48%(4th toughest)
2009-10: 0.65(3rd), -9.0(5th), 1st(of 5), 42%(2nd toughest)
Summary: Some interesting stuff here. In Phoenix, and last year in Florida, he was used on the go-to pairing, and didn't do particularly well. But in 2008-2009, playing mostly with N.Boynton, he saw 2nd-pairing minutes (he was stuck behind Skrastins and Bouwmeester), and beat them up pretty thoroughly. Hopefully we'll see more of that than the "Ballard tries to stop the Thorntons and Kovalchuks of the world--with hilarious results" show that the good people of the sunbelt have been subjected to on even-numbered seasons.
***
Miscellany
-Ballard provided maybe my favourite moment of the 2009-2010 season.
-Ballard appears to love the hipcheck. No, seriously, it might be an addiction. (That fight against Crosby, btw, was one of, like, two wins given to Ballard in something like 20 NHL fights. Neither here nor there.)
-Ballard once blew up one of eightyseven's cousins.
***
Conclusion
I think, in a vacuum, Keith Ballard's a great player to have around. He's a fine option to roll out for 2nd-unit special teams duty, and he might very well be a good player for the Canucks if they're able to find him 2nd-pairing minutes and matchups. He hasn't shown an ability to be a particularly effective top minute guy, though to be fair to Ballard, he's still quite young and hasn't exactly been paired with world-beaters. I suspect if you were to pair him with a Pronger or a Weber he'd hold his own well against the NHL's first lines. The Canucks, unfortunately, don't have such a luxury, and I have a feeling something like a Ballard+Salo pairing would get eaten alive by the Thorntons and Toews of the world.
Which brings us, sort of, to my main problem with Ballard: he's no great bargain. $4.2M per is a fair chunk of change to lay out for any defenseman, especially for five more years. Given that Ballard's proven little more than an ability to be a good part on a bad team, it's a bit of a scary proposition. I'd be happy to pay him that on the open market, but given that we had to trade--and dearly--for his services, he'd better have another gear to his game if this is going to work out for Mike Gillis. If Ballard's able to assume a Willie Mitchell-type role (taking on the best and treading water) at any point during the length of his contract, I'll be ecstatic and a little surprised. I suppose we'll see.
Long story short: I kinda like Ballard, and I think he'll provide average value for his money. I'll be pretty scared, though, if we go into the season with him as our top defensive shutdown option.
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Nice job PV. Two things:
1. Donny said in this thread the Crosby “fight” was bullshit. Getting jumped after he destroys Malkin of all people.
2. Since Gillis said he wasn’t done yet, I’m suspect that Ballard is suddenly our #1. Hamhuis is still there, though that would require the loss of someone like Bieksa who I do really think will be moved as early as today or sometime early in FA. Mitchell is still an option to return too, assuming the health claims are legit. All in, I view Ballard as part of the solution, not the solution.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
Yeah
I think people are jumping on this too soon as “the solution” to our D troubles, when Gillis clearly said “we’re not done yet”. Of course if at the end of free agency Ballard is left as a top pairing guy…I might begin to worry.
"Playin hurt, baby that don't faze me. I don't got time for pain. The only pain I've got time for is the pain I put on fools who don't know what time it is!"
Also
The Panthers guys seem a bit torn on the trade. Looks like Ballard was very team oriented, and has a desire to win. Which are big positives in my mind. Also, the fact that he waived a NMC to come here means he is okay with it.
"Playin hurt, baby that don't faze me. I don't got time for pain. The only pain I've got time for is the pain I put on fools who don't know what time it is!"
duckie!!!!
i love ducks.
Nucks Misconduct contributor.
Also on Twitter.
Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
Me too. Especially of the Niedermayer variety.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 26, 2010 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions
no, i hate those suto-ducks.
i love real ducks.
Nucks Misconduct contributor.
Also on Twitter.
Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
the Anaheim Ducks aren’t actually ducks, they’re just an annoying hockey team.
Nucks Misconduct contributor.
Also on Twitter.
Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
yes, you’re both right, my bad.
Nucks Misconduct contributor.
Also on Twitter.
Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
Specifically a male mallard. That’s a nice one. Everyone loves ducks.
Nice analysis Passive. Great stuff.
Without crunching it all down into the numbers like you did so well, I think its important to remember a few things.
The man played on two teams that were pretty bad. I have no doubt he got beat a few times because of that, or had some of those stats go down. It is all relative.
He was an 11th overall pick. For the minutes played and contributions as an overall good player ( does a bunch of things well, but not a world beater ) Plus what Semi Colon said ( and I agree with…I do think being a good “team” guy is worth something. His ticket may be a bit much, but I think it’s important for people to remember that is for ( what, 4 or 5 yrs? I have heard both in reports ), which includes a big chunk of the guy’s free agency years. In an escalating market, I don’t mind the 4.2.
Especially for a guy that will go through a wall for his teammates. At 5-11, he plays bigger. He hits a lot, and likes to make it hurt. Only missing 13 games so far while playing that style? A guy that blocks a lot of shots too? Works for me. I look at him as a better Bieksa, and I think Juice will be traded soon…by FA at the most.
Just my opinions, but it is pretty wild how the Canuck Nation is so polarized on the guy so quickly. I think it was Smo’ ( ? ) that said he would be the Canucks’ fave whipping boy for the 10/11 season. The Fan Poll on SNET last night was 49/51 against, for instance.
Let’s let the guy hit the ice first!
Part of the objection
…is the cost, both in trading away and in actual money.
He seems a second pairing guy to me, and frankly not a step up on Bieksa. He pulls himself out of position to go for the bit hit and he’s an agitator with a short temper who’s a bad fighter. And he cost a lot of cash.
On the other hand, he is a good open-ice hitter with some offence, blocks a load of shots and can eat minutes by the scoop. Plus he’s only 27 and signed for several years.
If Ballard is compared to anybody, it’s probably Jovanovski when he was with Vancouver.
God I hope
he’s better than that, defensively at least or we;re really fucked.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Hamhuis
Do the analysis on Hamhuis. He’s a 3/4 guy in Nashville too… and would have cost us more.
I think Ballard will do fine in Vancouver.
at ES, he comes out looking better than Ballard IMO. he would have cost us more in dollar terms, but a lot less in Grabner+25thoverall terms.
by Passive Voice on Jun 26, 2010 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Basically
Cost us Grabner + 1st rd pick to get Ballard at 2.2 mil
Bernier was a salary dump more or less…
In today’s NHL if you want to unload a bad contract it’ll cost you.
Grabner was expendable, would have rather seen a lower pick go than a 1st rd pick.
But the window is open, we have to go for it now…
We didn't have
a lower pick except the 4th rounder, but the fact Gillisgan didn’t at least get a 2nd/3rd coming back is brutal, or at least a prospect better than a 24 y/o borderline NHLer.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Hamuis
would not have cost Grabner and a 1st rounder, and he is better than Ballard, defensively at least.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I know what he was talking about
but he’s left out a huge cost of the deal that makes the comparison to Hamhuis silly.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Gillis clearly was worried that he wouldn’t get a top 4 dman in July, which is what happened last year:
http://communities.canada.com/theprovince/blogs/whitetowel/archive/2010/06/25/gillis-on-ballard-trade-bernier-and-grabner-were-redundant.aspx
Also, you are leaving out a crucial part of the deal, getting rid of a one-way 2million dollar contract for a two-way, half a million dollar contract. He didn’t get a draft pick, but he picked up at least 1.5 million in cap space he can then offer to Hamhuis, or another FA. If he needs it, Gillis can stash Oreskovich in the minors, and he gets another half million to offer an FA. Calling Oreskovich a “prospect” is missing the point.
Ballard is a proven 5v5 guy, played tough minutes last year in Florida and did well enough, plays the PK, and signed through his prime. Good trade.
Then why not
just trade Bernier for a draft pick? Even a 3rd rounder?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Who would take on 2million for Bernier? Most teams are either up against the cap, or rebuilding, and Bernier is overpriced. I’m sure Gillis tried, but, let’s face it, Bernier is not a good player, esp with his cap hit, and all GMs have mistakes like that, and the question is how to get rid of them. Tallon is rebuilding, and so was the perfect GM to take on cap hit, esp as part of a larger deal. Tallon apparently wants to get rid of all his core to rebuild, and go for the cap floor for a while.
PS
It’s kinda like asking why Doug Wilson didn’t trade Lukowich last year for a draft pick. The whole reason that Gillis landed Ehrhoff for two marginal prospects (former #1 Nonis pick notwithstanding) was b/c he was willing to take on Lukowich’s salary. Draft picks are the only way to get cheap players, esp right now with the slow rise in the cap, and so no one gives them away, esp for overpriced players.
The whole reason
Gillis got Erhoff so cheap was that SJ was desperate to unload 2 big salaries in order to get Heatley.
This is no where near that situation.
No one gives them away especially for overpriced players???
You mean like giving away a 1st rounder for a $4.5M #4 dman?
And btw, with that 1st AND a good young prospect going their way, (and a decent young power forward, overpriced as he is, with top 6 minutes Bernier could still bloom) Gillis should have insisted on at least a 3rd/4th round pick coming back.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
$4.2 million, not $4.5 mill. And Bernier was not blooming on our team. Still possible, but we gave him 2 years. We don’t need a roster of ‘could blooms’.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 8:33 AM PDT up reply actions
splitting hairs
but on Bernier, was it not Gillis who gave up several good picks to get him, then re-signed him for $2M to be a 3rd liner? (which I said at the time was stupid btw) I mean he said himself that once Burr established himself as the twins perfect mate, Bernier didn’t have much of a chance, so why re-sign him just to bury him? Why not let him go as an RFA or trade his rights for a pick then? This is Gillis to a tee, half-witted, half-assed, half-measures…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Now I can definitely agree with that.
Regardless of differing opinions on the deal, I think it would have been that much more palatable to the Canuck Nation if he got back a 3rd or 4th.
Myself, I think Ballard can be good here, but I get the differing opinions.
Every poll so far in the media seems to be 50/50.
Florida had the edge in negotiations. They had a rumored 10 deals for Ballard and Gillis was sold on getting him clearly. If the deal started as Grabner/Ballard only if they accepted the Bernier salary dump, they countered with a first rounder and Gillis was already on record that he thought the class was weak AND he still waited for his choices to drop to #25. Getting Oreskovich was maybe in exchange for that pick he asked for. And Gills (rumored anyway) tried to deal with Boston who had two picks in the second round.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 9:16 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm not saying
Ballard can’t be good, I think he’ll be a solid 2nd pairing guy that can probably contribute in a number of ways, I just think way too much was given up for that kind of guy who will not be a difference maker or even address our biggest needs.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Ballard
I watched him a lot in Phoenix couple of years ago, and liked him a lot. He’s what Bieksa is when healthy and playing well – you know, three years ago. I don’t give rats ass if he wins his fights – he doesn’t shy from anyone. Ballard upgrades the Canuck D, and with Mitchell likely gone already, and Salo with only a year left in his life, Ballard forms part of a core moving forward with Edler, Erhoff, and possibly Bieksa if he ever gets healthy and back to his older form.
Bang on
he’s no great bargain. $4.2M per is a fair chunk of change to lay out for any defenseman, especially for five more years. Given that Ballard’s proven little more than an ability to be a good part on a bad team, it’s a bit of a scary proposition.
Especially considering what was given up to get him, never even played a single playoff game either, great, now we’ll be even less experienced on the blueline…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I’ve seen a lot of posts on this trade now, and yoata is the only person with a serious beef. Sure, there is an element of overpayment – but we won’t know if this is a good trade or not for 2/3 years.
In the meantime, surely even you yoata can admit that this Nucks team is better off. Closer to having a contending team. I’m not saying we’re there yet, far from it, but Ballard gives us an improved D at no ‘current’ cost. If we are ever to win, we need to do it in the next 2-3 years. Waiting for a #25 draft pick to develop into a full-time NHLer and using Grabner on the third line doesn’t get us closer to winning the Cup – this trade does.
There may have been a better return for our package elsewhere, but I’m very happy with this trade. I think we all will be come April/May 2011.
Welcome Azzy
I agree with you for the most part. And I assume you’ll be jacked for the England match tomorrow morning?
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 26, 2010 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, but I’m less confident about England than I am about the Nucks…too many players out of form / tired after a long season. The Germans prepared well, play as a team, and they have history on their side. Just glad we avoided Ghana!
by Azzy Mahmood on Jun 26, 2010 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions
I saw them play algeria and it was less than inspiring but I have faith. I’m a big england fan, rooney cracks me up.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 26, 2010 4:59 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Well…that turned out well huh?
Did you watch Mike? It was like watching the Nucks play the best midget team in the province or something.
Except in this case, the youth of Germany just ran faster than the old English legs…even with the disallowed goal.
Oh well, time to switch over to Argentina I guess!
Oh yeah, fucking brutal. England had no offense, a suspect mid and their defense was raped. Who runs a 4-4-2? No way man.
Its all about tomorrow…holland or bust for me now. Actually I am for chile too, but if holland gets bounced I may kill myself and everyone around me.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 3:11 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
If Holland gets bounced, my girlfriend will be disconsolate for weeks, so I hope they don’t!
Honestly, I hope its a Brazil/Argentina final myself…
I’m all about Spain and Argentina. I dunno if they can possibly both make the finals, I’d have to check the brackets, but that would be the bomb diggity.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Unfortunately no
Spain-Argentina is a possible semifinal. What I’m most annoyed about is that one of Uruguay or Ghana is going to be in the semis (probably against either Brazil or Netherlands). The final should be good, and the one semi should be incredible, but Uruguay or Ghana don’t really strike me as a great semi participant.
Gotta play 'em, might as well win 'em.
Uruguay has been great so far. Forlan is a spectacular player. They’ve won two World Cups before! Granted, their heyday was 60 years ago…
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 28, 2010 7:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Aaaaaand…they won through to get there.
Can’t argue with results.
Of the two, I do like Uraguay, but I think Ghana’s speed will take them quite far.
Gyan is going to get paid big time after this WC.
Can’t see Ghana beating Uruguay. Forlan and Suarez has been spectacular.
It makes me so sad that Forlan didn’t play like this at Manchester. He could have been such a stud, a perfect compliment to Van Nistelrooy.
by Vancouverguy on Jun 28, 2010 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Yoata’s only real beef is with class and debate. He’s a troll and little more. A few people here have stated they don’t like the trade and think it’s bad for various reasons. The difference is most of those people don’t end up getting in arguments with people by being douchebags.
I’m on the ‘for’ side. I tend to have faith in the guys hired to run things regardless of who they are until they mess up. Regardless of what Yoata Burke says, gillis hasn’t really messed up any worse than any other GM out there.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
No
they are not better off, especially if as indicated they are basically replacing Bieksa with Ballard, which is only a marginal improvement. And that’s just on the ice, as an organization they have given up way too much in terms of assets (that could either have developed into future impact players or been used to make an actually significant improvement to the lineup.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Can we all stop with the psycho-analyzing of yoata? It’s a form of slander. If you have a beef with him why not email him?
Perfectly understandable Sean
when a halfwit/coward like Twitchy hasn’t got the capacity to come to grips with the realities being pointed out to them, the natural defense mechanism is to attack the messenger.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
lol
of course it is, what’s good for the goose…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
yeah, that was slander too. I regret saying anything now.
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 26, 2010 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Many people disagree with me…im ok with it. I’m an opinionated guy so, yeah by nature i’m going to meet people who have opposing views. I enjoy debate, and I’m not afraid to change my viewpoint if i’m convinced. The thing is, you’re just a jerk to everyone. I don’t know if u noticed, it wasn’t anything u said to me that prompted that. And you obviously haven’t noticed that you’re the only guy here who regularly incites people to the point where they actually post in anger. It must be hard to live with that much disrespect to people.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
by Twitchy2010 on Jun 27, 2010 12:03 AM PDT up reply actions
Funny
how you completely ignore the fact that the disrespect virtually always starts in the other direction.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
But why don’t u see the point that nobody else here earns that kind of response? Why is that? Not even me, and i’m certainly not immune to posting first and thinking after. Ever think that maybe something in your manner causes that?
Ok, with respect to everyone else, I am done, apologies to all. Reached my yoata saturation point yesterday I guess. Unlike VanCity Dan I didn’t have the brains (read: my g/f wasn’t hear to be my conscience) to take the high road to just leave the site for a while.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
by Twitchy2010 on Jun 27, 2010 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions
^^ I’m gonna go ahead and blame my slight hangover yesterday for my short tolerance level, btw. It’s fun to defer accountability!
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
by Twitchy2010 on Jun 27, 2010 10:28 AM PDT up reply actions
What part of
the word “starts” are you having difficulty with?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Yep…thats why I love her!
All kidding aside, I didn’t even want to have any conflict. All I challenged in the man was that if my opinion on the Ballard deal differs, its better to tell me the reasons than yell at me.
Its not a new thing. I have resigned myself that you have to take the bouquets with the brickbats, to paraphrase the old expression. Not everyone is going to agree, or even see the brilliance of our thoughts sometimes…
Peace to one and all….
It's all well and good
to claim one doesn’t want conflict, but then if one were sincere in that regard one probably wouldn’t use terms like “idiotic” about another’s opinion on a hockey trade.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Nor would they call someone an asshole, or make disparaging remarks about their partner.
A creep from the cradle, but a hero's what I want to be
Hey
I’m not the one claiming I never wanted conflict, that would be as disingenuous as dan doing so.
As I’ve said before, I’m not above responding in kind to another’s disrespect, you want to ignore the cause and pretend the effect came out of no where, go for it but it won’t make it true.
As far as dan’s girlfirend goes, again, he brought her up, I think my response was on par with him doing so.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Look, son….I will say this once, so you have no confusion.
I never have wanted conflict with you. I have tried cajoling, humour, anger, and just ignoring you. Taken shots and given them. It is just not worth it anymore…what’s the point?
You seem to have a hair trigger and an inflated view of your own opinions whenever I say something. I don’t know why. I have ceased to care though. You are simply not worth the bother.
I did not even read what you said about my girlfriend. It bothers me not. From what others have reported, it was bad. I think others have said that for me, so..whatever it was, it really doesn’t matter to either one of us.
Whatever. That’s for you to live up to.
All I remember saying back there is that she has helped me deal with mean people. ( you know, like the old poster…God grant me the serenity…etc etc…)
If it makes you feel better, I do agree with some of the things you say. But you tend to not extend the same courtesy, and after a while, a one way street gets a little boring. Just more of the same, over and over.
Its OK that you don’t like the current GM as much as I ( and others) do. Thats the great thing about having a conversation. But that never seems to happen for us, does it? Just gainsaying and the same old thing.
So, if its an apology you want, for some perceived slight, I AM SORRY. That is not disengenous, it is not insincere, it is not sarcasm. It is a surrender though.
OK? You are always right, in any catty comment you make to any comment I happen to post. As I said before, I realize that to enjoy this site, I have to take the good with the bad.
I honestly have no idea what your problem is, but I do wish you well in your life son. As you mature, you will realize you can’t always be right.
There is no cause and effect there. Just reality. Be a good person and you will get good back ( sorry…little newagey, that’s her words, not mine! ) And I will be the first to admit that I should practice what I preach. Though I do think I have over the past year.
So…as before…respond, don’t respond. I have no opinion either way. But please, just leave me alone.
Talking puck is one thing…but going after my girlfriend just showed me that there is no respect coming back the other way, and if there isn’t that, what’s the point? Personally, I find these little firestorms annoying and beneath BOTH of us.
Sorry for the ramble on…but there it is. From here on in, if you don’t like something I have said, its OK to say so. It is not OK to get personal.
Look at this this way…if it is not something you would say in a “polite” conversation, just don’t say it. I will try my utmost to do the same.
But I won’t after this post, get into any philosophical dancing on the head of a pin with you. Who said what, and “how dare yous” bouncing back and forth. It is not pleasant or fun…which is why we come here, right?
by vancitydan on Jun 29, 2010 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
So
you haven’t read it, but you go on a diatribe about it?
You basically said that your girlfriend doesn’t like me.
I basically said that didn’t bother me much considering that since she’s your girlfriend she can’t be much of a judge of character.
That’s it and that’s all, it was intended with the same tonet as your comment was, and in fact if read correctly is much more of a slight on you than her. You brought her into the conversation, I just adapted it.
You and others want to make a mountain out of that molehill, that’s your problem, not mine.
And like I said before “dad” (btw I’m sure I’m not supposed to take any disrespect at all from you constantly calling me “son” btw eh?) it’s all well and good to claim you don’t want conflict, but they are pretty hollow words coming from someone who takes issue with another’s opinion by calling it “idiotic”… you seriously claiming that is “polite conversation” ???
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
The reason, sean, is that people can disagree with virtually everyone who posts here, except yoata. He doesn’t seem to realize he’s the only guy who has these battles with virtually everyone who doesn’t have to be diplomatic cuz they’re the site boss. Even Missy got into it with him once. MISSY! It’s easy for him to sit behind his keyboard and call me a coward i guess. It may or may not be true, but sadly for him, he’ll never actually know.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
by Twitchy2010 on Jun 26, 2010 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Site boss?
What are you talking about?
I’m not choosey about who I give disrespect back to that has given it to me, if that’s what you’re implying.
Missy has come after me a number of times out of the blue and for the most part I’ve just brushed it off or made a joke of it.
But yeah let’s make this thread about me, it’ll be fun!
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
it’s only been twice, actually. the first time was when i was drunk during a GDT, so you can blame that on alcohol. the other time was just friday night, which i’ve already brushed off.
anything else you’re thinking of would’ve just been joking around.
but let’s all just take a chill pill here, okay? we can have our disagreements, and the occasional debate, but everyone (hear that? i said EVERYONE) should remain civil and stay away from personal insults.
Nucks Misconduct contributor.
Also on Twitter.
Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
Agreed. Keep it to talking about Ballard, Gillis or whoever else. Don’t start in with personal attacks on people, significant others or anything else. Bring that over to the CDC if it has to happen.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 8:32 AM PDT up reply actions
Wow...
I just joined because I love talking Canucks, and I normally love what people here have to say, but this has become ridiculous.
Sean and Yankee – I love your site. The rest of this was just a huge waste of my Sunday.
Go Canucks.
by Moose Canuckles on Jun 27, 2010 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions
sorry about that, dude. and welcome to the site!
as for the rest of you: see what you’re doing? you’re scaring away the lurkers instead of trying to get them to join the conversation!
Nucks Misconduct contributor, can be found on Twitter.
So, what exactly is Mike Gillis up to?
Welcome MC. Passions run high this time of year, no worries. Glad to know you’re on board.
'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.
by Yankee Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 3:14 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
not even knowing Ballard’s on-ice PK shot rates from 2008 can save your weekend? sadface.
by Passive Voice on Jun 27, 2010 3:47 PM PDT up reply actions
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
by Twitchy2010 on Jun 28, 2010 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions
A little
tension helps the blood pressure stay up.
Right?
"Playin hurt, baby that don't faze me. I don't got time for pain. The only pain I've got time for is the pain I put on fools who don't know what time it is!"
I agree
it was just a couple times and the rest mostly mutual half-joking harrassment.
As far as brushing off, I’m almost always willing to let bygones be bygones, it’s only those who make a point of constantly starting things up with me that make that difficult, but even then I rarely hold a grudge.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Shit
is getting real between yoata and the rest of NM
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
"One time I was invited to come to a social gathering. I was paid a handsome amount of money, and I brought a shotgun and a bottle of Tanqueray and showed those people the best f***ing time they’ve ever seen." - Kenny Powers
C Henrik Sedin #33: Vancouver Canucks Alternate Captain and 2010 Hart Memorial Trophy Winner
by Chuckles Canuckles on Jun 27, 2010 1:58 AM PDT reply actions
“I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.”
by marcness52 on Jun 27, 2010 8:54 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
rec'd.
Nucks Misconduct contributor.
Also on Twitter.
Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
Missy apparently is a bit behind in her Tarantino, but up on her Voltaire
:)
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 27, 2010 9:20 AM PDT up reply actions
truth be told, i’ve never actually read Voltaire.
i just think this was the appropriate time for that epic quote.
Nucks Misconduct contributor, can be found on Twitter.
So, what exactly is Mike Gillis up to?
I suspect that Neidermeyer’s retirement had a significant impact on Gillis’ decision to go after defencemen via trade. With Anaheim in the market for at least 1 top 4 dman, I think it greatly reduces the chances of landing Hamhuisunless you are willing to significantly overpay. With Pittsburg after a top 4 dman as well, the bidding is going to go high.
As for Volchenkov isn’t going anywhere for less than 5M – if he was Ottawa would have signed him by now. I think it will be close to 6M and I doubt he’ll head west.
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