With Mason Raymond's emergence, with our lineup, it would have been very difficult for Michael to get in. If Mason continues to advance and gets into the 30-goal category, our third line can't be constituted with guys who are goal scoring players. We were fortunate to have that kind of redundancy so we could look at trade like this.
Grabner is a really good player with big upside. But you're not going to get an NHL defenceman without giving up a player like that.
Mike Gillis on letting go of Michael Grabner. Botchford from the Province talked to our GM after the 1st round of the draft.
almost 2 years ago
missy
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I think this trade is for the best after hearing the rationale.
Grabner scores goals, but he was no Stamkos. Bernier had no place after Burrows found magic with the Sedins (and was a salary dump).
Ballard is a solid player who has offensive ability AND helps us now. The key thing I think is that he’s signed for 5 more years, meaning none of this inflated D-men salary (4.2 will look pretty sweet after someone signs Hamhuis for 5 and Volchenkov for 6).
Its true....
That we need a top defenseman more than those two guys… BUT
Three first round draft picks for one expensive defenseman (+ a throw in)? He better be damn good.
??
where’s the 3rd 1st round pick coming from?
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Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
by Buffalo. we got him for 2nd-rounders.
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Still waiting for the Canucks to win the Stanley Cup.....
correction: San Jose drafted him
and his worth has significantly dropped since then.
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Irrelevant
Lots of guys would be taken ahead of where Ballard was in his draft year too if it were re-picked today, but Bernier as weak as he is, is still young for a power forward, more potential for improvement there than with Ballard.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
missy
I’m not saying it’s a bad deal, I’m just stating the fact that we traded three first round players for Ballard and a big but unproven prospect.
I’d much rather have Ballard if he is that damned good than 3 offensive picks that don’t crack the top 6.
This could turn out to be an awesome deal for the Canucks, awesome deal for the Panthers, or maybe it will be both. Here’s to hoping it swings in our favor!
I think it’s not that meaningful to call someone a first round player. Once you’ve been picked, you’re just a player. Saying what round a player was picked in, especially a few years out, is just a commentary on a previous valuation; it says little about who the player is or what his value is thought to be today. Trading a future first round draft pick has an entirely different meaning to me than trading a player who happened to have been picked in the first round.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 25, 2010 10:27 PM PDT up reply actions
Depends
both Bernier (who I don’t mind seeing go) and Grabner are still certainly young enough to realize 1st round potential.
Again, don’t mind using the assets, but you’ve got to get more of an impact player in return for those of that quality.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Again, I’d just say they’re young enough to realize potential. Just like I would say Edler is young enough to realize potential, even though he wasn’t drafted in the first round.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 25, 2010 11:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Brutal…thats all I have to say…brutal. Grabner is going to haunt the Canucks with this trade…he’s going to be a stud.
Just brutal…
i think this is somewhat true, but mainly because he’s going to a weak east coast team where he’s going to play a lot of minutes next year. he wouldn’t develop the same trying to find minutes on a contending team in vancouver. i also think his ceiling is just decent top 6 forward, because he doesn’t have the inherent self confidence to be the guy. the cam neely deal comparisons are far fetched.
I’ll continue…
One of the deepest drafts in a handful of years and what did the Canucks get out of it? An over paid d-man…a possible plus in Oreshkovich…and thats it. We lose a top prospect, Hands of Stone AND our pick.
Cam Neely anyone??
Yep
but I also think you are overrating Orshkovich, he’s 24, borderline NHLer.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
That, and it’s possible Gillis thought only Timandi (sp.) was the only one worth getting with his 1st pick, and Montreal took the guy, maybe that’s why he thought the 1st pick is expendable.
by Vancouverguy on Jun 26, 2010 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions
If that's what he thought
he’s even more of an ass, to say that nobody past the 24th spot will ever be a quality NHLer is to ignore a long history to the contrary.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Overall I agree with you on this, yoata. A lot of good players have been picked with the 25th overall in recent times. Patrick Berglund, Andrew Cogliano, Steve Ott, Jiri Fischer, Brendan Morrow, Cam Ward, all since 1997. A lot of junk too… e.g. Patrick White by one apparently wonderful GM named Dave Nonis. But I digress. Like I’ve said before, we have to accept that we’re going to have to give up some future to get some improvement today.
by Beantown Canuck on Jun 26, 2010 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions
The problem
is not giving up to get, the problem is giving up way to much to get way too little.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
oh look, a rumour on twitter that bieksa could move tomorrow….
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Great
that’ll move Ballard up to a solid #4, and is he even an upgrad over Bieksa or did we just trade valuable assets to trade one Bieksa for another?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I don’t know which Ballard video I like better:
the good: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv0yrQZ_Wdg
or the bad: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI21yeqmZgA
I don’t think the Canucks would have ever consistently gotten more than twenty goals a season out of Grabner. It’s sad to see his speed go, but we know that they need more grit in their lineup, and this trade provides that in spades.
Grabner will do better in the east, and I have a sneaking suspicion that Ballard is going to be a workhorse in the playoffs. We know the Canucks need a guy like him, do you really want Alberts out there killing penalties against the Hawks? Fuck no, so you get a hardnosed guy like Ballard in there for next season, there was no way to guarantee that our first round pick would be NHL ready by next April, and when you’ve got guys like Salo playing with a busted nut, you need to know you’ve got someone reliable who can eat up a lot of minutes, make opposing players regret entering our zone, and throw his body in front of pucks. Ballards it guys, like it or lump it, he’s our boy now, so dust yourself off and get back on the wagon!
by Sandwich76 on Jun 25, 2010 11:28 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I don’t think the Canucks would have ever consistently gotten more than twenty goals a season out of Grabner.
I don’t necessarily agree with that. No…I don’t agree with that at all. Florida got a gem in Grabner. I’ve seen enough of his play to believe so.
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 25, 2010 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Florida got a gem, but we only lost a second wheel. It would be ridiculous to have developed raymond to where he is and then let him go so we could do the exact same thing with grabner. It woulda been awesome to keep grabs, but we got more of what we needed and let go of some of what we have an overabundance of. That’s not a bad trade. As far as bernier goes, I’ve said all season I’d love to see him go somewhere where he finds a way to reach his potential. Maybe Florida will give him that. And as mentioned, losing a pick isn’t the worst thing in the world; it’s not like we don’t have an amazing development system anyways, and that one guy we would have drafted is not the going to be the missing wheel that knocks the cart off the path. No, all in all I think this is a fine deal for Vancouver. It remains to be seen how big a performer Ballard becomes here, but I agree with whoever it was who said that ballard very well could be a clutch playoff guy for us. I was a bit bummed to lose Grabner, but I see the reasoning and I don’t disagree with it.
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
If Ballard fails, all will remember this day.
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 26, 2010 2:51 AM PDT up reply actions
Well that can be said of any trade…
The artist formerly known as GAHHHHH!
"You'll be playing in England the rest of your career" Alex Burrows
"I'm not a water dwelling mammal, where did you get that preposterous hypothesis, did steve tell you that?" FotC
the love for the BC leaf has clearly clouded your vision
by Sean Zandberg on Jun 26, 2010 9:32 AM PDT up reply actions
It's amazing
how great Ballard has become now that he’s a Canuck.
Somehow I don’t any of you were doing any raving about him 2 days ago, also quite amazing how such a terrific dman (such a rare commodity that you have to give up the farm to get him) could have been traded 4 times by this point in his career…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Well the only thing we knew about him 2 days ago was that he whacked Vokoun with his stick. You can’t judge a player on 1 incident. We’re not ‘raving’ about him but it’s an upgrade. You gave Gillis hell last year and at the trade deadline for not doing anything and now that he has made a trade you’re still giving him hell. I guess his mistake wasn’t that he made a trade but that he didn’t get Doughty, Keith, and Seabrook.
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