Necropsy
by Kent Basky on May 13, 2010 12:43 PM PDT
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Printnecropsy - an examination and dissection of a dead body to determine cause of death or the changes produced by disease. Sounds about right. Let's take another look (because that dead horse ain't gonna beat itself...) at the Canucks season and demise. First we need to step back into the 'Wayback Machine' and go to April 10, 2010. It was on that date that I wrote something that upset a lot of you. Go read it, then come back here... I'll wait.
Yeah. This is where I say "I told you so". Am I happy I have to? Not fucking likely. I feared this would happen and it came true. I tried to be positive. I tried to 'Believe In Blue'. But just like I said in that post, every issue that could keep us from going further, did exactly that. Some of you were a tad upset when I laid this out. But honestly, if it's obvious to someone like me, how is it that some of you who are more than likely smarter and more knowledgeable about hockey not see this coming? Denial, perhaps? Horrible thing, that.
Our battered defense was no where near good enough. Even totally healthy, they would have struggled. The offense clammed up. And the goaltending? Well... not gold medal quality, that's for sure. I could sit here and dissect every single thing that went wrong, but others have done to death already. Since I know the majority of disagree with whatever I say regardless of whether it's the fact that I'm right or you're wrong, here's what I would like to see to resurrect this rotten, festering corpse. And yes, in advance... you can all kiss my ass. :)
GOALTENDING
Great teams are build from the net out. I don't give a shit what anyone says, Roberto Luongo is still a top notch goaltender. He has however had too much piled on him, and the Canucks would be better served to do the following for next year:
- Re-sign Corey Schneider and bring him in as Luongo's back up, and give him a minimum of 30 games next season. Luongo the workhorse is not working. I know it sounds crazy, but the idea of a goalie with something left in the tank come playoff time sounds intriguing. Seemed to work well for some team that embarrassed the Canucks in this series. Again.
- Take the captaincy away. Is he a good leader in the room? Sure. Is he right for the 'C'? Absolutely not, his post-game interviews hammered home this thought. This doesn't mean he is any less important to the team or franchise, but it's apparent to anyone that knows even the slightest about hockey that he cannot handle the pressure. More about my thoughts on who I would like to see wear it next year a little further down the page.
- A full time goaltending coach is a must. Whether it's personal choice or a money decision, this needs to change, especially if Schneider is to be worked into the system.
No panic. No 'trade Luongo' nonsense. Just better asset management. And don't let anyone fool you. Roberto Luongo can still do this, he just needs to not have to do it alone.
DEFENSE
5 defensemen signed to contracts next year. 2 are UFA's. The need is obvious, isn't it? I believe an overhaul on defense needs to start with cleaning house, and that means dealing the oft-injured Sami Salo and Kevin Bieksa. I know what you're thinking, who would take them, right? Perhaps... but never underestimate the GM's of other teams willingness to make deals that seem bizarre to you. We need a stud Dman, and the rest of the core to be filled with defensively sound, stay at home guys. Ehrhoff, Edler... these two were decent this year, Ehrhoff especially. They can stay. Shane O'Brien however is more hassle than he's worth. I also believe they should re-sign Aaron Rome, and Willie Mitchell. And while you're at it, throw the 'C' on Willie's chest. Should have been who they put it on in the first place.
FORWARDS
The Canucks strength during the regular season was their top 2 lines. The bottom 2 left a lot to be desired however, and while some players did improve, changes are needed. Something about size and grit, I can't recall really. Re-signing Mason Raymond is likely to be a priority, but I have a feeling it's going to be a costly one. Pavol Demitra is gone, Steve Bernier should be (and I am talking a bag of pucks-style salary dump here) and believe it or not, so should Kyle Wellwood. As popular as he is, and as well as he played in the playoffs, that spot belongs to Cody Hodgson next year, no point in having him around. I also think it's time to let Jannik Hansen go, and call it an experiment that didn't work.
COACHING
Here we go. Meat of the problem as far as I am concerned. Vigneault was being outcoached in the LA series, and had his ass handed to him again by Quennville for the 2nd straight season. But it wasn't just him. Special teams this season were a nightmare, and one of the biggest reasons we find ourselves in the morgue. After 4 years of Alan Vigneault and no real improvement despite being told this was the best team yet, the time has come to move along. Goodbye AV, don't forget to take all your unused timeouts with you. Goodbye Rick Bowness and your failed defensive strategies. So long Ryan Walter and your gawd-awful hair special teams. Here's a thought, let's not let Scott Arniel get away and be the next coach to knock us out, let's take him and actually utilize the investment the franchise has put into him and aiding the development of our youngsters. But god help you all if you bring in Ken Hitchcock. I mean it.
So there you go. My thoughts. Like 'em or not, I don't care. There's nothing anyone can say, friend or foe that can bother me about this. Perhaps this quote from the original article said it best: At least we're conditioned for the heartbreak to come. There's a familiar comfort in this misery. That's what sucks. The familiarity of it all.
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Totally agree with the fire AV sentiment. He’s a good coach, but hasn’t demonstrated enough to be considered a ‘great coach’ (Jack Adams notwithstanding), at least in the playoffs. The best coaches use their timeouts wisely (Quenneville), know to lock it down defensively when their top guys are injured (Martin) and generally inspire confidence (Babcock).
It was a bold move to fire Denis Savard, a beloved favourite in Chicago, and it will be a bold move to fire Vigneault.
very prescient
you predicted the outcome of the series all the way back on monday, that’s like nostradamus-level foresight.
i think i’m pretty well known on this site for my “pessimistic” attitude, and i found your prescription for the canucks depressing. they’re a good team, they don’t need to be blown up, they just need some decent big bodies that can play sprinkled into the lineup. tough players that can soak up the punishment of playoff hockey and dish it back without getting worn down. alberts and bernier are big players that play small, kesler is a small player that plays big, demo is a small player that plays small. where is the big player that plays big? specifically a beefy 3rd line center and a moose of a man on defense would push current players like wellwood and bieksa to better suited roles.
blow it up? I never said anything about blowing it up. The core remains intact. The dead weight leaves. How in the hell do you get blowing it up out of that?
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
And what were you expecting, flowers and puppies? Not gonna get it from me. Sucks you wasted your time reading my drivel then. At least you didn’t have to pay for it, eh?
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
that came across a little more snarky than I had anticipated.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Man stop
making excusing for Luongo already, he fucking sucked this postseason, and he fuckng sucked last year against Chicago.
I’m really thinking he may be today’s Curtis Joseph.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Excuses? It’s not an excuse. It’s a realistic look at the situation. He’s the goalie. He’s unnecessarily overworked. And he caved under the pressure of the spotlight.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Realistic?
“He’s still a top notch goaltender” and then you go on to “explain” why he failed so miserably at looking like one?
If those aren’t excuses what are the?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
A mature look at what might have caused the breakdown perhaps?
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Luongo playing
like a minor leaguer instead of a $7M “stud” perhaps?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
with a minor hockey defense in front of him
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
LOL
Never ending excuses…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
And what about
the simple “reason” being that Luongo choked… again… ?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Fine he choked
let’s all agree. He choked. So what can we do going forward to help him not choke in the future?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions
"We"
can’t do much, we are not management, obviously they have to do whatever they can to help all of their players be their best, what makes you think they aren’t already doing so? I mean Gillisgan is the king of pet theories on player maximization.
But what about Lu, he’s supposed to be the consummate pro, why isn’t it up to him to make himself better, he’s hardly a kid.
I want the C ripped off his fat head but not just in the hopes it will make him better, he doesn’t deserve it, I don’t think he’s shown leadership in any way.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
You make great arguments
but then you say things like “fat head” and it makes you seem like you have something personal against Luongo and it undermines a lot of what you are saying.
How do you know Luongo isn’t doing everything in his power to try and be better? Because he hasn’t been better. The absence of results doesn’t mean there is an absence of effort.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions
How is it
personal that I think the guy is an egomaniac who can’t see that he’s letting down his team?
That = a “fat head” imo, sorry if you don’t like it.
I don’t really care if he is doing all he can, if he is it just proves that he’s not good enough under pressure, which is what I’ve been suspecting for some time. If he isn’t it shows he’s not professional enough.
Regardless, don’t give me excuses or “reasons” give me results.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
OK then propose some solutions
since Luongo obviously can’t give you the results you want. What’s the solution?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:10 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m pretty sure Luongo knows he is letting down his team, it’s been pretty clear in his reaction to both playoff losses last 2 years.
Your doubting whether Luongo is actually a great goalie, but look at some other goalies, like Nabokov for example. He’s been no hell most years, this year he has been better. Chris Osgood has never been a spectacular goalie, but still has won. Fleury has proved inconsistency in the playoffs and regular season, and has still won.
So what am I getting at? The goalie contributes less towards keeping the puck out of the net than most people believe. However, I do still believe Luongo would need to be better than this year to win the cup. Defence and backchecking can deter a large portion of scoring chances though.
Unless you believe “minor leaguer” is Luongo’s true talent level, there’s a reason behind it. Who knows; it may just be random variance. I think it’s well worth changing things up to try and help the dude out, though, because he’s gonna be here a long-ass time.
by Passive Voice on May 13, 2010 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions
Probably somewhere in the middle.
Luongo could use more help, yes.
Luongo could also stop easy shots that a “stud” goalie has to make.
Both would be good.
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
No one is excusing him for his play
But it’s ridiculous to think the organization shouldn’t be looking for ways it can help him to have better playoffs. And maybe giving him more rest throughout the season is one way we can try to have him better prepared come next year’s playoffs. Taking the C away is another move that could potentially be made to lessen the burden on him. These aren’t excuses. He was bad in the playoffs. No one is excusing him for that. Get over your anti-Luongo shit man. It’s tainting the way you are reading and responding to everything written about him. He is going to be around for a long time.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
totally agree. asset management.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
So what
if he’s going to be around?
That means he’s automatically wonderful and beyond reproach?
“anti-Luongo” ??? No, anti-overrated, overhyped, overpaid underachievers who get excuses made for their poor play at every turn and refuse to accept responsibility for it.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
ffs
he’s not beyond reproach. my thoughts were clear: take the C back and cut back his ice time along with a full time goaltending coach. That’s a reasonable and realistic response. That and a D that doesn’t leave him hung out to dry night after night…
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
LOL
ALL EXCUSES!
For a guy who has now shown 2 playoffs in a row that he has a tendency to CHOKE when he is needed most.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
YEAH! Like in game 5, when he gagged loudly on the road.
by Passive Voice on May 13, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions
NO ONE IS MAKING EXCUSES
we are looking for ways to help him be better next year. Should we just wash our hands of the next ten years and say well fuck it Luongo isn’t good enough but we are stuck with him so let’s not try to help him get better let’s just sit back and lose in the second round every year?
He is going to be around for a long time so our organization needs to do as much as it can to help him improve.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions
No argument
but I’m sorry WAACH is most definitely making excuses, as he has all year for Luongo.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
yeah constructive ways to make sure we get the most out of a goalie we have locked up long term are excuses. you sure nailed me on that one. red faced here, and working on my retraction as we speak…
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Here's a thought that might make this argument mute...
Is Luongo even movable with that contract?
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
he’s not. Doug Maclean works for sportsnet and even Don Waddell isn’t that stupid.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Why can't people
differentiate between performance and contract term?
As in how in the fuck does how long he’s signed for change how he’s played?
I’m talking about how he’s played, and he’s played fucking awful.
.895 SV%
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I didn’t sign him, I just watch here.
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
.895 SV%
Goalie stats can be team stats. They aren’t a sure shot to be indicative of performance.
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't really see excuses
I mean maybe the one about the D was an excuse. But it’s also true in some ways. Our D wasn’t nearly good enough to compete with the Hawks. Did Luongo bail them out? No. Could he? Sure if he was able to play his best in the playoffs for long stretches. Maybe we find a way to win the series.
The Hawks are, in my opinion, by far the best team in the league right now. I don’t see any way they don’t win the cup. They were better than us. That said Luongo should be able to steal us a series or two and he hasn’t really done it yet.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Halak
didn’t need any excuses to get his team past the high-powered Pens, even with their D decimated…
And he’s not supposedly one of the best in the world at stopping pucks…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Right well this is actually
an interesting point. Because you can’t build a team to try to win a cup based on the hope that your goalie is the one out of the 16 playoff goalies who gets hot and carries your team. You can’t legislate for that. Which is why I think you need to get a goalie with world class ability, like Luongo, and do your best to get the best out of him.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Which is why
and I’ve had this discussion with you before, you can’t determine whether a guy is a world class goaltender until he gets it done in the post season.
I mean how do you sit there and say a guy that has blown up the last two years in the 2nd round is “World Class” ???
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
You blame this loss on Lu? Not on ‘they were better than us and our whole team was defensively crap’? I would say he wasn’t good, but I wouldn’t say he ‘blew up’ or anything of that sort. Niemi wasn’t any better in the Chicago losses… was he blown up?
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions
The lion's share
of the blame goes to the big cat.
Seems to me he’s gotten most of the credit for the team’s “success” since he’s been here…
You telling me he wasn’t by far the biggest fail in the post season?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
No he wasn’t. I would say the defense was awful, but they haven’t been good all season, so that’s not really a fail but a ‘less than hoped’. The offense I think was as much of a fail as Lu. Those were supposed to be our two sets of strengths.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Which is basically to say, the result was a team fail.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Sorry but
when your “superstar” goaltender that your team is built around lets in 5+ goals three times in a series, you’re fcuked, I don’t care who is scoring or not scoring…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
.895 SV%
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Yeah but how many of the goals in Game 6 do you pin the blame on Lu? I don’t think any of the first three goals were his fault at all. And the game is already lost on those 3.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Doesn’t he pretty well have to stop Bolland, who barely shot the thing?
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
Still the problem is Demo far and away on that one. yoata’s rant seems to be that if lu was an average goalie we would have won this series… which seems ridiculous to me.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Less we forget
Have you all forgotten that sick goal he let in that ended their season his first year? I watch with my kids all year long… My daughter wears the pink “1” jersey… Not once has this guy stood up for his team. Shared his blood with theirs. I would have started Raycroft (who I have alot more respect for… and I think his team believed in) this playoff season. Atleast we would have had an honest goalie in net and not this over paid actor. Shit I’m mad as usual this time of year…
You know, I made that suggestion myself earlier on
by Sean Zandberg on May 14, 2010 12:48 AM PDT up reply actions
I didn't say world class
I said he has world class ability. He has all the tools physically to be world class. We can agree on that right? He doesn’t seem to have the mental side at this point. But physically he has all the tools at his disposal.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Splitting hairs
again, goaltending isn’t about “tools” it’s about performance, especially when it counts the most, until he proves he has that, he’s little more than an overpaid overhyped prima donna.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
The NHL pays players based on regular season play
that’s a fact. He isn’t overpaid based on his regular seasons. I don’t think you should call him over payed. I don’t think he is over hyped either since the consensus seems to be that he isn’t as good as we all thought. And there is no way we know if he is a prima donna since we aren’t in the dressing room. He might be but you are basing that on his media interactions which is never a representation of what kind of player or person someone is. Did he fail this post season and choke? Yes. But as for the rest of it I can’t agree.
And it’s not splitting hairs.
Which is why I think you need to get a goalie with world class ability, like Luongo, and do your best to get the best out of him.
That’s what I said. World class ability. That’s what I was talking about. The ability to be world class. If you don’t agree with that it doesn’t change what I meant when I wrote it.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions
The NHL
doesn’t pay anybody, teams do, and wtf makes you think playoff performance doesn’t factor into contract value???
How is that a fact???
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Yeah, I’m with yoata on this.
How many times do you see players get big raises after winning a Cup that they otherwise would not have got?
Poutine & Meatballs
Very rarely
When I said the NHL I meant the teams in the NHL obviously I am aware who pays the players. If you think I am that stupid yoata don’t even bother responding to me since I won’t be smart enough to understand what you are saying anyway.
The vast majority of contracts are awarded based on regular season play. Otherwise half the players in the league wouldn’t be getting paid.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Is Raymond expected to get a big raise
because of his playoff numbers or his 25 goals in the regular season?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Well if it's both his raise won't be as big
since he wasn’t great in the playoffs. He wasn’t a 3 million per player in the playoffs and that’s what some people seem to think he will get.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m not saying contracts are solely based off of playoff performance, but it definitely factors in somewhere.
I think that if you perform well in the playoffs you definitely get some extra $$ than otherwise.
He was good in the playoffs but I think the fact that Kesler was average (due to injury) held him back from being better. I’d give him $2.5Mish.
Poutine & Meatballs
Some guys have gotten
big contracts based on playoff performance. Horcoff for one. And look how horrible that contract looks now!!! I wouldn’t award contracts based on playoff performance if I was a GM. I’d be afraid of being the guy who gave Horcoff 7 million a season.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions
That's the folly
of paying based on playoff performance though. Those kinds of contracts never work out.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Horcoff is an extreme case though IMO (dumb ass GM). I can’t think of another recent situation like his.
I think it works out more often than not. ie. Staal, Getzlaf, Perry, Zetterberg, Franzen, Samuelsson, etc.
Poutine & Meatballs
Gtezlaf and Perry
didn’t make the playoffs this year. Neither did Staal.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions
I was talking more about their total play not dropping off like Horcoff’s. Getzlaf and Staal battled significant injuries this year. Their Olympic performance is enough for me to say that they still “got it” when it matters most.
Poutine & Meatballs
The point is they are players who
have good regular season numbers and playoff success. They get paid cause of the first one more than the second one.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:54 PM PDT up reply actions
About K.Lowe and his amazing negotiating skills
Also, this whole back and forth about Luongo has pretty much been the highlight of my day. Thank you.
well something has to make you smile, ya poor bastard… :)
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
It's not
one or the other Section, saying that does make you seem to lack intellligence, BOTH factor into it, and it is my right to use the term overpaid whether you like it or not.
As I’ve said repeatedly, imo great goaltenders are those who get it done in the playoffs, therefore since Lu never has, he is not an elite goaltender imo and should not be paid like one, and since he supposedly is and is sucking up a big chunk of cap due to being the “cornerstone” of the team’s “success”, it makes it more difficult for the rest of the team to be as good as they could be if he wasn’t overpaid.
Same goes for overhyped, how many times have you heard “best goaltender in the league/world” about Luongo? Sorry, not until you can at the very least get past the 2nd round, I mean the finals at least… without choking…
prima donna because he almost always refuses to accept any responsibility for his own poor play, even seeming to be incapable of seeing it no less.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I wasn't saying you can't
use it. I said I don’t think you should. And I tried to explain why. You can feel free to use whatever terms you want. But if I don’t agree I will tell you why I don’t agree. All of what I wrote was just my opinion. And obviously it differs from yours. No big deal.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Shhhh!!!! It undermines my argument
a little if you keep naming Oilers.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions
and if Halak loses in 4 straight in the next round.. what then? Even if he wins the Cup, there’s no guarantee he does anything after this. History if full of players that get hot in the playoffs then never do anything again.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
I see what you did there…
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Halak is a lousy comparison. He’s playing over his head.
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions
There's probably
even less guarantee that Luongo will ever even get that far once…
But I guess he’s still “World Class” since he’s had a few good regular seasons…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
What do you just want to be right? Luongo sucks, you win. Now what?
Gripping the Stick Too Tight - Pointless rants about the game we love. Because its our game too.
Have you seen the Habs play?
They play a TEAM trap game, block a ton of shots, and keep everything to the outside; making it easier for Halak. Most goalies would do well in that system IMO.
But I agree that Lu sucked this year.
Poutine & Meatballs
Have you seen
Halak’s SV%???
The guy has been sick this post season, the Pens badly outshot them despite all the blocks and he still stoned Crosby, Malkin and the like… right after he stoned AO, Backstrom, Semin and the like…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I asked the question though
how do you legislate for a hot goalie? How do you build your team for that? Who will be the guy who gets hot next year and carries a team? Cause there is very little chance it will be Halak.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:52 PM PDT up reply actions
How much chance
is there that it will be Lu?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I have no idea
probably roughly as good as it will be anyone else. But you can’t hope for that. You have to build the best team you can and put your goalie in the best position for him to succeed. What else can you do?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Look
you want to jump for joy that we have a repeat playoff choking “world class talent” locked up in nets for the next 12 years, go for it, but don’t ask me to blithely agree.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
So are there only 2 options in the playoffs? Choke or ‘hot as shit’"? Because the evidence isn’t there for that. Niemi is neither, but if he didn’t have Seabrook/Keith in front of him, would he therefore become a choker for that reason alone?
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Who said
there were only two options?
If Lu had been just average we’d probably still be playing.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
He was pretty average. The defense was well below average. Shitty defense plus average goaltending against the blackhawks is a guaranteed loss.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Dude
How am I jumping for joy? I am agreeing with you on almost everything you have said so far. Answer my question. What else can the Canucks do?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Fire Gillisgan
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
At Luongo's age
he’s probably as good as he’s going to be.
If he can get his fat head out of the way of his team maybe he can get them past the 2nd round, but I ain’t betting on any Cups.
Fire Gillisgan before he does anymore long term damage.
Souptin and Demo not enough proof for you even without Lu’s potential albatross?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
What about all the good he has done
though?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:23 PM PDT up reply actions
Not
near enough.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
And 2 years
is long enough to judge him?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Give him
another 6 months?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I'd see what he does this off season
and if it produces playoff results next year before deciding. Maybe he has more Ehrhoff moves up his sleeve and no Berniers. I would make him replace AV with Arniel though.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Arniel
I’ve heard he’s been a great Coach on the Moose, but haven’t followed it closely enough.
What has he accomplished in his coaching career?
What had Carlisle
accomplished?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Gillisgan
could well be sealing his own fate if he doesn’t replace AV… but then again it puts egg on his face if he does since he just gave him a big extension…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Yeah that extension
annoys me. Everyone in the league seems to rate Arniel highly. It would be a waste to let him go.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Gillis
likes himself a yes man…
and he’s not the greatest judge of ability..
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
You think AV
is a yes man?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Something tells me
he is with Gillis… or who knows maybe they’re both so blind that they really are on the same page…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
How does that help the on ice team?
What does the next GM do with Luongo’s contract? How is the team better for firing MG based on a contract that is already on the books?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:20 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m not questioning whether or not Halak has been sick, he has.
But he’s had a lot of help from the team in front of him too. Mostly in the form keeping shots to the outside, blocking shots, boxing out the players in the slot area, not giving up many odd-man rushes, letting him see shots, etc.
I’m not making an excuse for Lu. I already said he sucked this year.
Poutine & Meatballs
Argument
I’m starting to believe the argument is with WAACH rather than Luongo. Just let it go man, let it go…
I don’t think it’s me…
:)
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Disagree (unsurprisingly) on a couple points
Hansen – experiment gone wrong? Great wheels can kill penalties, can step up a line or two if needed in an emergency. Pretty good size. Plays on my 4th line anytime. Not to mention he can still be signed relatively cheaply.
Hodgson – the spot on the third line isn’t his until he earns it or better yet is given the chance to earn it. You can’t just anoint him the 3rd line center at this point.
Rome – Doesn’t do anything well enough to deserve to stay. IF he is part of our D, even as a 7th or 8th guy, then we are going to have similar problems depth wise again next year.
Willie Mitchell – Still not symptom free and is a UFA. Very little chance he is back. If he is it’s not to play in the top 4. No way he gets the C. You can’t give it to him if you aren’t sure how much he can play and if he is likely to only be around another season or two. Kesler is the obvious choice for captain.
Corey Schneider – Too value as a trade component. If you want to improve the D you can’t do that and keep this kid. Not gonna happen.
I agree about Arniel replacing AV. I agree we need to revamp the D. Although calling the season Ehrhoff had “decent” is maybe the understatement of the year. We do need to give Luongo more breaks.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:11 PM PDT reply actions
that's it?
Hmmm. Guess I need to hang it up as a writer if that’s all you disagreed with…
:p
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
I tried to find more
but Salo, Bieksa, AV, Wellwood, Demo and Bernier all need to go.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Salo?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
yes Salo.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Salo and his NTC....
…are staying in Vancouver.
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
He might be staying that doesn't mean he should stay
He is good when healthy. But not healthy enough. And he is getting older. I would like to see our D get younger, faster and hopefully a little better.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions
That would be nice
I just think that unless we’re talking about blowing things up and competing in 5 years as opposed to tweaking and gunning for next year, we might as well plan around Salo, since he’s here either way.
And he was our best d-man this year. I’d say you use him.
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
Salo
makes this team better, no doubt about it, love how some think you improve by taking away positives.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
No but you improve the team
by getting in a D man as good as Salo but more durable. He has been hurt at the crucial part of the season the last 2 years. We aren’t deep enough to make up for that. So we have to get someone with a history of being more durable and hope for the best.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm not advocating just dumping Salo
but I would like to see his spot go to someone else if possible. I don’t think a team with Salo in a prominent role wins a cup. I hope I am wrong.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions
correct me if I'm wrong
But doesn’t a player’s salary not count against the cap if he is injured? That means the Canucks just have to plan their defense around the fact he will be injured for half of it.
If we have to build a team in a way that we don't have to rely on Salo
for half the year. Why not go with a team that doesn’t have him for the full year?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions
yeah cuz
guys as good as Salo grow on trees.
Then we agree Bieksa should go, Mitch may have to retire and even if he doesn’t how effective will he be, well that’s 3 of our top 5 gone, how do you propose to replace them with better?
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Free agency, trades, bringing players through the system
you know the usual way players are acquired brought into NHL teams.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Pretty generalized
sounds a lot more like hope than a plan…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Entirely hope
He is good when healthy. But not healthy enough. And he is getting older. I would like to see our D get younger, faster and hopefully a little better.
I hope our D is younger and better next year. I don’t have a plan because it would go to waste anyway.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:40 PM PDT up reply actions
I said it
before this season, but I was a bit early I think, Edler is going to be a stud, maybe as soon as next year, he, Erhoff, Salo and hopefully Mitch still make a good top 4, and who knows maybe Bieksa stays and returns to form, he does seem to step it up in the playoffs. SOB I’d like to see more of, he has all the tools, except maybe brains, but needs to settle down a bit more, still young for a dman, seems to have turned a corner late this year. Alberts maybe under a new coach?
Some good young prospects, like to see one make the team, and add a big solid shut down guy if Mitch doesn’t come back and/or a QB type if Bieksa doesn’t.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I agree on Edler
and I think SOB can be good. I think everything that went on this year woke him up a bit. Might be a beast next year after putting in the work this offseason. I think the top 4 you mentioned with Willie is good. Just not good enough to beat the Hawks.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions
SOB and Rome are RFAs though, as are Raymond, Hansen and Glass.
Demo, Wellfed and RJ open up some cap, but still just 13M for quite a few needs unless they dump.
IMO if there’s no place for Bernier in the top 6 he has to get moved, even just for a pick, can’t have a guy making $2M not producing in the bottom 6.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Well I think if MG is bold
there are moves to be made and as I mentioned somewhere else we have lots of good prospects, maybe more than ever, and we are close to be a cup team. So this could be the most important summer in franchise history.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:17 PM PDT up reply actions
But does he
have the balls to make the big move, especially if it means having to give something up?
We certainly haven’t seen it yet.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I think he will
his stated goal was to build up the farm system. I think he did that. And I think he was doing it with this type of offseason in mind. Now that we are close we have the pieces to move to get over the top. If he doesn’t do that then let him go.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Agree on keeping Salo
Maybe often injured, but man he scores some clutch goals when he needs to. And you gotta give him some credit for playing with a broken nut, even if it did hurt the team more than benefit. Canucks need to get some heart when they’re in the playoffs. Kesler and Burrows have it, although neither were too impressive this year.
Those are all things I acknowledge
I NEVER said Salo isn’t good. We are a better team with him. For all the reasons you mentioned and more. But we are more often than not without him when it matters. That’s the whole point. He is too important and too expensive to not be around when it counts year after year. So replace him with someone who will be there. Again in a perfect world. Not saying it will happen. Just that it should.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Ehrhoff was our best D man this year
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions
We can agree to disagree then
I always felt more comfortable with Salo on the ice.
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
Erhoff
wasn’t nearly as good in the postseason as he was the regular.
Bieksa the opposite, and Eds was a monster in the playoffs.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
General thoughts
G: Luongo is around for a while, so we need to get used to it (regardless of whether or not that’s ideal). Schneider needs to be traded because of the fact Luongo will be around), and MG needs to have the guts to do it. I’d prefer a similar league minimum signing to last year (someone like Raycroft).
D: Top flight guy needs to be acquired either via trade or FA signing. Salo has a NTC, and isn’t going anywhere. Bieksa needs to be moved. 3 of the top 4 spots can be Salo, Ehrhoff, Edler. I don’t want Volchenkov (product of system and playing with Phillips). Michalek or Kaberle preferably (or someone better if MG can be really ballsy and make an aggressive trade). Hamhuis as a last resort. Alberts can play on the 3rd pairing (thanks to his salary), and pair him with a similarly remunerated individual.
F: Resign Raymond and your top 6 is set. Tell Hodgson the 3LC job is his to lose. Resign Hansen. Only resign Johnson if it’s 1m or less. Grabner-Hodgson-Hansen and Rypien-Johnson-Hordichuk (or whomever, he’s already here).
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
I still think your original post was douchey, and I stand by that.
My issue was never with the legitimate concerns and doubts you had about the prospects, but about your prescription at the outset that they you believed they had no hope. Douchey douchey douchey. And this “I told you so”… also douchey.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 1:30 PM PDT reply actions
Noted… and not really concerned. See ya next year.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
It is a little bit,
I don’t want to say douchey but I can’t think of a better word. It is a tiny little bit douchey to predict playoff failure and then say I told you so. I mean the odds are so far in favour of playoff failure, only one team wins the cup, that it isn’t like you went way out on a limb.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions
You can’t think of a better word because it’s pretty much the correct word. Definitely douchey.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't want to use that word
cause it’s harsh.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions
it’s fine. I’ve been a Canucks fan since I moved to BC in 73. Skin gets thicker through time.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Hey now… I’ll be here all summer too, will you?
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions
now and then, trying to get my medical issues dealt with and hopefully resurrect my music blogging/podcasting , but I will still be popping around, just not posting as much
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
the I told you so stuff was designed to get a reaction, nothing more. does that make me a douche? oh well… I didn’t predict failure to get a pat on the back, I predicted failure because it’s what I saw from the team, and I said unless they show more. for the majority of the playoffs, they didn’t.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
To be clear, I’m not saying you’re a douche, just that you write douchey blog posts :)
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions
my work is me, so fuck you.
just kidding. better to be thought douchey than to sit unread.
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
as a Carcass fan, I felt it appropriate. I spared you all the accompanying videos though, because I had a few in mind… I will however leave all of you with this one. Perhaps dedicate it to Yoata :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8-J4hL7iDM
Nucks Misconduct's Grumpy Old Man
WAACH Blog/Podcast- The 38th best Canucks blog on the Interwebs
Luongo needs another season, to be re-assessed.This is the first year that he kind of broke-down at the end of regular season. Every single season (I am talking about regular season), except this one, he was called “great”, “unbelievable”, “spectacular”. So, let’s give him the next season and see whether or not he can return to that form. If he can, there is no reason not to expect that he can do a few of those great games in the playoffs. This season seems to be an aberration. It is not fair to jugde him solely on this.
Look at Giguerre. He was unbelievable for the Ducks for a couple of seasons, and then replaced by a rookie. He was an average goalie who got hot in the playoffs.
On the other hand, Luongo has a consistent track record for regular seasons, he just needs to carry it over to the playoffs. He doesn’t need to get hot, just stay the same. Just like Joe Thornton, who may finally have shed his playoff reputation this year.
Los Angeles, CA
Last half
of last year Luongo was highly inconsistent as well, started before the All-star break
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Ok, but isn’t this the first ever season with the Canucks when this happened? He certainly deserves another full season.
Los Angeles, CA
2nd
year in a row he has choked in the 2nd round…
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
I was talking about regular season.
This is the first time when he wasn’t good all the way to the end of the season.
You are right about the playoff chokin, but this year he chocked because he just carried over his inconsistent play from after the Olympics.
I want to see him next year having another great season, and then watch him in the playoffs. If he chockes again (after being great all year), then I’ll give it to you, that you were right.
Los Angeles, CA
Again
I think it’s a replay of last year.
He was highly inconsistent the last half of last year too, and carried it on into the playoffs.
I couldn’t care less if playoff chokes follow a good or bad reg season, just get it done, that’s what winners do regardless.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
Well, if you have a bad season, followed by a bad playoff run, you can’t call that a choke, can you? You are just being bad from the beginning to the end.
A choke is, when you are great for most of the time, and then all of a sudden you can’t get it done when matters the most: in the playoffs.
Remember the original chocker: Naslund at. all, flying high for a long time and than crashing and burning at the end.
Los Angeles, CA
Naslund
wasn’t the choker on those teams. Cloutier was.
A choker is a choker no matter what the reg season was, Curtis Joseph had lots of good reg seasons, never even made a final.
Then you look at what Osgood’s reg season was last year and he carries his team almost to they Cup after it.
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep the Pesos
Yeah that seems fair
As the Captain,
Naslund just took credit for all the chokes (unlike Luongo, of course).
Los Angeles, CA
The Captain's "C"
Hey guys and girls, I’ve heard a LOT of arguments for Luongo giving up / being stripped of / passing along captaincy to another player…
But who takes it?
I’ve heard people mention these posibilties:
Ryan Kesler
Sedins (co-captaincy)
Samuelson
Mitchell
Alberts (okay maybe not)
Luongo (keeps it)
You can’t just take it away from Lou and give it to no one! Who should be the new (or same) captain of the Vancouver Canucks?
Kesler
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Kesler is the known consensus. Look at the contract they gave him.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd be okay
with Henrik getting it. He’s been a lot more vocal this year, and very much a part of the team and community. And this is from someone who is NOT a fan of a teams best player getting the “C”…
Not to let Lu off the hook but...
He did have a lot of work this year, and it seemed to me (and the stats seem to back up) that he just couldn’t find his game after the olympics. Clearly a 3+ GAA and a sub .900 SV% are not going to win you any cups, so maybe a decreased workload next year would help keep him sharp for playoff time.
Stats:
Before Olympic Break: 31 Wins 17 Losses 2.35 GAA .919 SV% 4 SO
After Olympic Break: 9 Wins 5 Losses 3.30 GAA .893 SV% 0 SO
Playoffs: 6 Wins 6 Losses 3.22 GAA .895 GAA 0 SO
yeah especially in the playoffs
i remember when he was with the wild and he would kill us, im pretty sure its 90% of the reason they went out and signed him.
yeah id like to see how much game Schneider has also...
I agree use him as trade bait but it seems like most teams are either happy with their #1 guy or have 2-3 young guys similar to him battling for the starting job.
Edmonton, Philly and Ottawa seem like the most likely takers, as none of them have a legit #1 or high end goalie prospect in their system.
Ottawa seems fairly high on their combo. I doubt they’d want Schneider.
But I’d be calling Philly and seeing what the parameters might be for a Coburn/Schneider swap.
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
Cobrun is a RFA isn't he?
They have cap problems? Just offer him a deal first and see what happens. I would like to get JVR off them for Schneider and play him with Kesler. Then Raymond could be moved to add D depth.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Coburn is RFA
If you trade for him, you save the picks (admittedly, not as valuable as Schneider). But I doubt they’ve give up JVR…would be nice though.
Knights, Canucks, Dolphins, Jays and Raptors all the way.
Man u guys love top 3 draft picks...
Sadly so do GMs who draft them and like being employed, JVR isnt coming here.
No one said he is coming here
I said I would like to get JVR off them. I never said it was going to happen. Fuck me.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Why tho?
Elliot and Leclaire both suck.
I can see teams like LA being happy with their tandems, at least they have upside.
Elliot sucks?
Really? .909 save% and 2.57 GAA in his first full year is pretty good isn’t it?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:52 PM PDT up reply actions
Don't put Howard in the same breath
as Rask. Rask is way better. There are also 30 teams in the league and you named 2 young goalies. Ottawa has to be happy with the guys they have.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions
True
Rask is intense, knew he would be ever since I saw him in the WJHC, another great move leafs.
I kind of want whoever
the Bruins pick this year to team with Rask and DOMINATE the Leafs for the next 20 years. Simply cause the one guy I know who is a Leaf fan is a really annoying. Imagine trading Rask when EVERYONE seemed to agree he was a stud in the making. And now possibly Seguin or Hall. The Leafs sure are stupid.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Simply cause the one guy I know who is a Leaf fan is a really annoying.
Better than the thousands that I have to dealt with over here…
Poutine & Meatballs
Yeah but when you live in BC
and live in a house with Canuck fans and watch the game with 5-6 Nuck fans and actively root for all of your friends’ team to lose you are a pretty big bag of shit if you ask me. If I had 5-6 friends that were Leafs fans and I was watching them play in the playoffs I would want them to do well so my friends would be happy.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions
You are too kind.
I wouldn’t be able resist the schadenfreude.
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
by Chuckles Canuckles on May 14, 2010 1:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Same
Burkie wins 1 cup with Murray’s roster and they hand him the keys to that franchise, and what a horrible trade that kessel deal was, even a 5 year old knows you dont give up 1st rounders when you have a squad full of AHL forwards.
Don’t underestimate what Burke is doing in Toronto. I see success ahead for the Leafs.
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Wha? I’ll bet you 50 bucks the Leafs make the playoffs?
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Cool. Just checking. Didn’t know if you remembered. Coulda been a Captain night for you ;)
Shove it in your addendum.
probably was because I did forget! haha. Plus I’m getting older…
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions
oo, Sean, you’re nuts. I kinda like Burke’s chances of a long-term turnaround, but next year? stranger things have happened i guess.
by Passive Voice on May 13, 2010 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions
hah, that’s fair, although he’s not exactly wallowing in cap space and stuff. but yes, i will hold off on pronouncing your $50 lost until the end of summer :)
by Passive Voice on May 13, 2010 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Didn't you say the the Flames would make the playoffs?
Proved you wrong, didn’t I Sean?! :P
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
by Chuckles Canuckles on May 14, 2010 1:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Well yeah but
The key to tanking successfully is to hold onto your picks. I admit I like what he has done with the D, but look at their forward depth chart sometime if you want a good laugh.
Now you are underestimating their AHL kids!
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions
If only they were in the AHL
im not sold on bozak, kulemin, caputi, mitchell, they all are border-line NHLers in my opinion and the stats seem to reflect as much.
kessel can play and ive heard good things about kadri, but other then that who projects to be legit top liners for that team?
I disagree with your assessments of Bozak, Caputi and Mitchell.
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh, I’m saddened by your belief in the Leafs. Reading your posts as a Canucks faithful, then finding out you thought there was something to like in what Burke has done! You ruined your credibility for me. Other than Burke getting rid of Blake, everything has been brutal. And I’d bet the Leafs don’t make the playoffs for the next 3 years!
then your credibility is shot to hell too
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions
But Leafs fans
will try to tell you that was a good deal. Apparently they thought they were a playoff team this year and “no one” expected them to be picking that high. Also, from what my friend tells me their D and goaltending is so good they will make the playoffs next year.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:12 PM PDT up reply actions
He's a decent goal scorer
but I don’t think he does much to make his team mates better. And I don’t think he is worth that many picks. Especially considering he wanted to goal to TO and everyone knew it. When you are negotiating from a position of strength it’s embarrassing to get ripped off that badly.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions
They haven't realized yet
how lost he is in his own zone.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions
They are pretty slow for the most part
they might need to extend him for a while to get it.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions
captain next year for
TO.
"But yeah…like CC…I harbour no ill will." - VancityDan
by Chuckles Canuckles on May 14, 2010 1:31 AM PDT up reply actions
Love Phaneuf so much
that they forgot Kaberle was there best defenceman and killed his trade value after Phaneuf came. And you don’t hear much about defenceman prodigy Schenn anmyore (and I hear a lot about the leafs living in Ont). Every move Burke makes puts a larger and larger smile on my face. How bad can he make the team and still have millions of people believing it is getting better!
The only thing worse than having
Burke or Nonis running your team is having Burke AND Nonis running your team. My buddy the Leaf fan tells me Nonis pulled the trigger on that Phaneuf deal.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Line Combinations for next year:
Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Samuelsson-Kesler-Hodgson
Raymond-Wellwood-Grabner
Glass-Johnson-Rypien
D:
Edler – Salo
Erhoff-Bieksa
Alberts – Morris
G:
Luongo
Schneider
Some lines might seem strange (Hodgson on the wing), but I think it is for good reason. I can’t see Hodgson being able to contribute to his full playing on a third line. He is a high-calibre player and should have talent around him. Now by looking at my lines, that’s basically this year’s entire team, so if you bring in some new players, then he could go back to line 3 if you have people to play with. Raymond has improved and deserves a 2nd line spot, but I think Hodgson would be better suited. As for d, pretty mucht the same. I would definitely consider getting rid of O’B or Alberts for a top 4 d.
Possibe FA pickups: Whitney, Cullen, Stempniak, Armstrong (any potential left?), Kariya, Frolov
Don’t really like any of the FAs listed. Stemp is gonna be hogely overvalued due to his last half season.
Shove it in your addendum.
Ha
Yea and I tried to find the best ones. It’s a pretty horrific FA list this year.
Maybe time for another Backes offer sheet. His value may have dropped a little after last year. Still think he has huge potential.
Shove it in your addendum.
Yea, a couple of those STL young players would be nice. I like that team, although I wouldn’t want to make it worse for my second cousin (the assistant coach)
David Backes would cause me to erupt in a Marc Staal/Shea Weber-level rosterection. he’s got another year on his deal though, but he’s UFA next year!
/trying to hide boner
//failing
by Passive Voice on May 13, 2010 9:00 PM PDT up reply actions
This team doesn't need
to add middle of the road players. It needs to get bigger and more effective on the 3rd line. Wellwood Grabs and Raymond don’t fit that bill. Samuelsson might though. I think we need a big time talent injection on D and to get bigger on the 3rd and 4th lines. Making Grabner and Raymond trade bait depending what you can sign Raymond for. They aren’t third line players.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions
Third line
I think the Canucks can have an effective scoring third line, but bring in more effective big players on the 4th line. It would be nice to have a 4th line that could be counted on defensively and bring up the tempo, along with counted on for a bit more ice time. Johnson is a FA, but I’d like to keep him.
Don't need scoring from the third line.
We have enough of that on the top 2 lines. What we need is a third line that can go head to head with Toews line and be successful. Shut them down the way the Sedins were shut down at times.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions
That would be nice
but, the Canucks the top 2 lines struggled at times to score as well. Perhaps some balance of scoring and defence would be more suited. I think Raymond is good defensively, maybe bring in someone like Cullen to centre him and Grabner or someone else. Probably someone else if you want a checking line
Where does the size come from then though?
Balance to me means two lines that score and two that play D and bang bodies. Plus our second line is only going to be better next year. Demo is gone and Hodgson might get time with the second line at least on the PP.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions
True
but unless you trade some players away, what are you going to do with them. Grabner is a faster Raymond with a better shot (that never hits the net, yet). He could use some weight and some experience and he’d be much better. I like what I see from him. Then you still have Hodgson on the third line if Raymond is on the second. So who do you get rid of?
And on the topic of bangin bodies, despite Hordichuk’s lack of hockey skill, I missed his 30 second shifts twice a game of going like a wild man rockin people. Damn!
Well the point is you deal
from strength which is the forwards to aid the D which is where we need improvement. A top 9 something along the lines of this:
Sedins – Sammy
Hodgson -Kesler – Burrows/Raymond
Burrows – ? – ?
Moving people to fill in the D and signing third liners who will have an impact. Something along those lines.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions
gillis stabs at Sundin 2 seasons ago. then Forsberg last season. Who’s next? I wonder if he’ll share your philosophy
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Who knows? It's going to be a very interesting off season
I think Sedin, Sedin, Burr, Kes, MayRay, Hodgson, Samuelsson are 7 good players to fill out a top 6 with one of them fitting in well on the third line depending on match ups. If you had a Cullen and a Ladd as part of a shut down third line?
Sedins – Sammy
Raymond – Kesler – Hodgson
Burr – Cullen – Ladd
That wouldn’t look too bad. Not sure you can get Cullen and Ladd but something similar?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Ziggy
He’s still going, played in the Olympics. I think the failure of those 2 cases should hopefully deter him this year from trying any of that
I’ll always like the Leafs. Just the way it is ya know?
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 8:38 PM PDT up reply actions
I would be OK with
Bernier on the 4th line if only he made 800K…then he would actually be a valuable player for us.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions
I agree
He’s pretty good for a 4th liner. He is like Glass with more skill. Too bad people thought he was going to be a top 2 power forward and paid way too much
Yeah he is bad cause of the contract
not cause he is a bad player necessarily. Expectations we/are too high.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions
well yea that’s basically what I had. I made the lines up of what we already have (other than I filled in Morris). And I said if we bring in some FA’s then that could change the 3rd line. I don’t mind the idea of Burrows on the 3rd line, but I’d miss his production. I’ve got use to the 35 goals that I wouldn’t want to lose it! lol. But he would definitely be good on a line of say: Burrows – Cullen – Dominik Moore? – not real big. Having trouble finding much for strong 3rd line players that aren’t like 40
Well I think like this past year
Sammy and Burr would alternate at times playing with the Sedins.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 4:01 PM PDT up reply actions
What about Ladd though
RFA but could the Hawks match an offer?
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 4:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Team chemistry
I’m not sure Ladd would contribute to a good team chemistry. Kesler already is a grouch as is. lol
That stuff is over blown
they would bury the hatchet and be friends before you know it. I’ve seen it dozens of times where guys hate each other on the ice until they play together and then they become very close. I don’t think it would be a problem. They are both professional enough and enough of team players to bury all that stuff in the past.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 4:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Dominic Moore. Love what he brings but you’re asking him to play for a team that was involved in crippling his brother. Don’t see that happening
by Sean Zandberg on May 13, 2010 4:29 PM PDT up reply actions
That was TrevorS
that said Moore. Not me.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Word
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions
ditto on all points. even though almost literally the entire organization has turned over since then (including, if i’m not mistaken, new owners, totally new management regime, new coaches, entirely new roster with the exception of the Sedins and Salo and new uniforms), i wouldn’t be surprised if he were averse to coming here. i’d like it if he did, though.
by Passive Voice on May 13, 2010 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions
But they probably couldn't
They have a lot of money invested already for next year, so they won’t be able to match much of anything for Ladd probably
I've always liked the idea of
having local guys and BC guys. Another reason I like Hamhuis.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Some decent RFA's
There are some pretty decent rfa’s this year. If Canucks were to bring in two top 6 d, I think I would go for Morris and Hamhuis. Hamhuis is fairly mobile, which our d lacks, and Morris would fill in as a bigger body. If the Canucks were to get rid of Bieksa, like most people want, they would need to replace him with a good skater. Although at times it looks like his first step on the ice, he still is the fastest.
A 40 goal season in the WHL
is nothing to sneeze at. Considering he was on a shitty team and had 14 more points than his next highest team mate. Could be a useful guy to have around in a couple years. Or as a thrown in to get a deal done.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions
I wouldn't mind if we signed
Braden Pimm. BC Boy winner of back to back Royal Bank Cups with Vernon. Heading off to Northeastern next year. Could be worth signing in case he blossoms in the NCAA.
"We love them, We mourn for them, Unlucky boys of Red" - Morrissey
"Giggs gets past Viera, past Dixon, who comes back at him, it's a wonderful run from GIGGS!!!" - Martin Tyler
"He's got a man deep..wait, no that IS Mandeep!!" - Don Taylor
by Section 312 on May 13, 2010 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Crap Game should start in 10 minutes. Think it’s starting to sink in. Typical that I’m off today.
Shove it in your addendum.
yoata, I find it odd that you have faith in the “promise” of our d-men, who absolutely sucked dick against chicago, but you think luongo is the most overrated piece of crap who’s the clear reason we lost. I don’t get it.
by Beantown Canuck on May 13, 2010 6:16 PM PDT reply actions
It's quite simple
I don’t think the D “sucked dick” against Chicago near as much as Lu did.
.895 SV%
Everybody knows
That the world is full of stupid people
Well I got the pistols so I'll keep